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End of the road for independent bike distributors?

bicycleretailer.com

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Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#71

Post by walshemj »

UncleEntity wrote: post #14
blakesterz wrote: post #2

Spent years working in a bike shop, so this was a really interesting read for me. He may be right, but I can't help be think that most people just don't care enough about their bikes to have enough customers to sustain a good Service Shop. Most people have a bike, but would never bother taking it somewhere fancy like this to get it fixed or serviced. They paid $100 for it at Walmart. He said something in there that c…

> Most people have a bike, but would never bother taking it somewhere fancy like this to get it fixed or serviced. They be pricy... A while back some girl hit me so we threw my mangled bike in her trunk and went up the street to a bike shop. Would've cost more to fix it (just in parts, who knows about labor) than I paid for the thing so we just went to their sister shop that sold used bikes and she replaced it out of…

Might be hard to fix an out of alignment frame

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#72

Post by rlonstein »

ams6110 wrote: post #23
criddell wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One model that wasn't mentioned explicitly in the article but I think might work is let customers have their bikes purchased online be shipped to the shop for assembly. I ordered my last bicycle from BikesDirect and it was tricky to get it set up just right. A bike shop could probably do it in an hour. It took me five or six hours. Even if assembly doesn't directly make a lot of profit, it's a great time to sell acce…

> A bike shop could probably do it in an hour. It took me five or six hours. Yes but then you miss out on an almost "bonding" experience with the machine and feeling of intimately understanding it. That's why I do most of my own car repair, even though it takes me longer than a shop would take. Read Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance about the "Romantic" vs. "Classical" approach to such things.

I think you mis-spelled "bodging" ;)

I've spent months, maybe years, of time fixing and maintaining cars, motorcycles, and bicycles. It's useful when something breaks on the side of the road or when you get an estimate for repair. There is the satisfaction of being self-sufficient and able to do it yourself. There's also the screaming frustration when you break something-- which happens when you're learning like over-torquing a bolt (tighten until it spins then back off a quarter, anyone?). cracking a housing, snapping the head off a stuck bolt, watching a unique and critical part improbably pick up speed on a flat work area as it rolls away from you drawn to the siren song of a sewer grate or a gap in the deck. I want to spend time with family, friends, on hobbies, or, you know, actually use my vehicle instead of recreationally bust my knuckles on it. I'm happy to read all the manuals and squint at exploded diagrams then pay someone else to do it while I go play.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#73

Post by curun1r »

whistlerbrk wrote: post #10

I have spoken with many bike store owners and employees, they know they can't compete with the prices you can get for parts and accessories from online retailers. But very few have an alternate plan. The ones I see who are being smart about this reality are instead focusing on having absolutely excellent mechanics and experiences like shop rides to get groups out on amazing day trips / overnights. There is a huge val…

One other thing that I wish more shops would offer is fit tests. The one I did was over an hour of adjustments to a stationary bike that was designed to be adjusted (i.e. the frame measurements could be changed) and them watching me ride it with a slow motion camera. At the end of it, I now have exact measurements that let me order a custom bike or know whether a stock bike will fit me if I order it online. It simplifies the online shopping process immensely because I know there are specific brands that simply don't work for my body type without extensive modifications once I get the bike.

It's probably not applicable to people who are looking for a $100-$200 bike, but for people that are looking at $2k bikes, getting this kind of test done is well worth the $100 or so that it costs. Having a bike that isn't just adjusted properly but is the perfect size for your body makes such a big difference in how enjoyable it is to ride. It's funny to look back at the first few bikes I bought and the buying experience. I basically looked at features, reviews and aesthetics to arrive at the one I wanted and then had the shop adjust it for me. And while I could ride it, it was never anywhere close to the comfort I feel on a bike that I've selected based on my exact dimensions and riding posture.

If people are going to buy their bikes online, shops should lean into that fact and try to provide services that facilitate the customers preferred buying experience. This kind of ~$100/hr service is both a money maker and a way to enhance the online shopping experience.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#74

Post by jacobrobbins »

CydeWeys wrote: post #68
Steltek wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spot on. Every bike shop has a "flavor". There was the "carbon fiber" shop where I'd get funny looks if I dragged my commuter bike in. They closed up shop and moved even farther into the suburbs. It'd take me an hour to bike there now. Then there's the "commuter shop". Where they charged $0 for labor when I walked in one cold, messy winter night with a shredded tire and a crazy story. That does simple fixes on the sp…

My go-to bike shop is a commuter shop right at the base of the Manhattan Bridge in Chinatown. He's always getting all sorts of walk-ins from, e.g., banged-up people whose brakes failed them on the downward slope into the city. The entire space is the maintenance area, and he's always right in front of you working on bikes. You can also order bikes online and have them shipped to him for assembly, and his rates are ex…

so glad to see that place mentioned! it was my morning coffee stop when i lived in new york. the owner/operator is great to chat to, lots of interesting stories about the neighborhood.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#75

Post by jdietrich »

jpao79 wrote: post #66

I'm surprised the bike manufacturers have not stepped up to create their own branded shops as a way to provide/control a more direct 'experience'. Imagine separate 'Specialized' stores, 'Cannondale' stores or "Gary Fisher' stores all with carefully crafted service and support. It's similar to how the local generic electronics store (including CircuitCity and now BestBuy) got squeezed from the bottom by Target/Walmart…

Specialized and Giant already have single-brand stores in many markets. Giant have a handful of stores dedicated to Liv, their women's sub-brand.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#76

Post by balabaster »

Dangeranger wrote: post #58
balabaster wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About the only work I don't do myself on my bikes is handlebar tape because I don't have the patience for that shit. But I'd rather have a bike repair shop at hand that I trust and will offer me the best advice, one that I know I can drop my bike off when I'm in a pinch, one that will tell me what I should order when I need it. I will order it from them every time. I don't want a shop with all the fanciest bikes and…

Yeah, usually the people with the best advice are the tougher older bikers who just want to ride. They've seen the hype cycle come and go a dozen times, and they just don't have time for that kind of BS anymore.

Absolutely agree. And it's the gruff and grumpy older bikers that I always go in search of when I walk into a bike shop. This is the kind of relationship I want with the service department in my bike shop:

"Hey you, you look like you've been in here since 1963, what can you tell me about this component?"

"It's shit, get this one instead. It does exactly the same thing, looks the same, feels the same, fits your bike the same. It costs about 20% more but'll last 10 times longer. The older design sheds muck better meaning less wear and the compound it's made from has the same tensile strength as the newer one but it doesn't rust because it was made before they cheaped out and started making shit quality product. I don't even know why the fuck they released this one. The old one was better. We're gonna stop carrying their newer stuff until they get their shit together."

They don't tend to mince words. They tell you exactly how it is, rather than exactly what they think you want to hear to get you to part with your money. In my opinion, you cannot pay enough to have people like this on your team.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#77

Post by jdietrich »

walshemj wrote: post #70
dmschulman wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is incorrect in my experience. I live in a city with a high percentage of bike commuters and they all ride bikes that fall squarely in the middle of your price range (anywhere from $400-$1000). There is actually an entire segment of the cycling industry that has sprang up around catering to this demographic, urban commuters who want something functional and hip looking and are willing to pay the premium, but don…

Unlikely in London where serious multimode bike commuters will be riding Brompton's of which the entry levels are about a grand and nice light weight on is more like £1700-1800

A Brompton is a superb commuter bike, but it's only one option. Most commuters don't need multimodal capabilities, particularly if they live within Zone 6.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#78

Post by hondo77 »

dockd wrote: post #44

As bicycles prices start moving toward motorcycles and cars, I don't understand why the shops still feel like the margins can't/won't change. They say 20-30% profit is small, but compare that to buying a new car: 2-3% profit. And to keep the car comparison going: during the summer, bike shops routinely book two weeks out, which is almost unheard of with car service. I'm both surprised and not surprised to hear that c…

> It is surprising to walk into a bike shop and want some shorts only to find they don't stock anything under $80--you really have to work hard to find $80 shorts at the mall. So maybe the problem is they need to do better at picking what their customers want.

Funny that you put it that way because I wouldn't buy any shorts under $100 (haven't found any at that price that will be comfy on a 100-mile ride). I suppose that's what bike shops are up against: customers whose wants and needs are all over the place, which is what suits big online retailers.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#79

Post by jdietrich »

icebraining wrote: post #51
UncleEntity wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people have a bike, but would never bother taking it somewhere fancy like this to get it fixed or serviced. They be pricy... A while back some girl hit me so we threw my mangled bike in her trunk and went up the street to a bike shop. Would've cost more to fix it (just in parts, who knows about labor) than I paid for the thing so we just went to their sister shop that sold used bikes and she replaced it out of…

Yeah, that's the typical result nowadays when manufacturing is so cheap. I can see that changing somewhat here in Europe as more new products get an ecotax slapped on top, but it will take a while to surpass the cost of a knowledgeable worker in a developed country.

It's more that the price benchmark has been set so low by Bike Shaped Objects.

A good back wheel will cost more than a bargain-basement department store bike. The good wheel will easily last for 10,000 miles if properly cared for. The department store bike will be good for nothing but scrap after a thousand miles.

The value equation depends entirely on whether you use your bicycle as a mode of transport or a piece of leisure equipment. For people who potter about in a local park once in a blue moon, a Bike Shaped Object is perfectly satisfactory. Their bike is probably going to rust away in their garage before they actually wear anything out. These cheap bikes are built as disposable items for infrequent and undiscerning users.

For a regular commuter, quality matters. It's worth paying $50 for a pair of Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires, because they're damned near impossible to puncture and they'll outlast four sets of off-brand tires. It's worth paying $60 to get your bike properly serviced, because a breakdown will make you late for work and preventative maintenance works out cheaper in the long run than neglect. It's worth paying $90 for a Brooks B17 saddle, because it'll survive until the heat death of the universe and it's as comfortable as an old pair of sneakers.

Re: End of the road for independent bike distributors?

#80

Post by jdietrich »

analog31 wrote: post #60
ams6110 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A bike shop could probably do it in an hour. It took me five or six hours. Yes but then you miss out on an almost "bonding" experience with the machine and feeling of intimately understanding it. That's why I do most of my own car repair, even though it takes me longer than a shop would take. Read Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance about the "Romantic" vs. "Classical" approach to such things.

For me, being self sufficient for maintenance dramatically alters my cycling experience. Taking my bike to a mechanic would involve loading it into a car and driving it somewhere, waiting, and repeating the process when the work is done. Naturally, it can take time to get parts, so if something is actually broken, then the bike is out of commission for a while. But a minor benefit of poor urban planning is that I've…

Basic maintenance is an essential cycling skill. Bikes are lightweight machines by necessity, so they can't be over-engineered for reliability. Bikes will inevitably break down on a fairly regular basis.

Fortunately, they're also boneheadedly simple machines to fix. You can learn to change an inner tube, align a derailleur, adjust a brake caliper and true a wheel in about an hour. If you have those skills, you can do 90% of your own repairs. You'll have an infinitely better cycling experience, because you won't end up stranded at the side of the road because of something that could be fixed in two minutes.

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