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Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

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Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#71
post #19

A translation of the open letter from advertising companies to Apple: September 14, 2017 We're just now realizing what this means. An Open Letter from the Digital Advertising Community "Community" means we're down to earth and neighborly. The undersigned organizations are leading trade associations for the digital advertising and marketing industries, collectively representing thousands of companies that responsibly…

Bravo.

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#72
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless I can build and install a completely custom version, it isn't open enough to be safe.

Can't trust the OS without all the code. Can't trust the code if you can't trust the compiler. Can't trust the compiler if you can't trust the CPU. Can't trust the CPU if you can't trust the microcode. Can't trust the microcode unless you've visually inspected the die. You can't win. Make compromises that are reasonable.

> Make compromises that are reasonable.

When it's so easy to use a community-vetted Linux distribution, I think "reasonable" gets shunted down a layer.

It's not all or nothing. Every reasonable step counts.

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#73
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of macOS is open source. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15251891 https://developer.apple.com/opensource/

Unless I can build and install a completely custom version, it isn't open enough to be safe.

You get my upvote, because I respect your perspective and I agree in principle.

But at its logical conclusion, this idea puts up some serious practical barriers. Even if you only use an OS that you’ve personally audited, and even if you’ve gotten past the potential Thompsonian compiler issues, you’re still left with a minefield of possibly-adversarial pieces of software that might interfere with your computing experience.

Have you audited your BIOS/UEFI firmware [0]? Your CPU’s microcode [1]? Your WiFi/Bluetooth adapter’s firmware [2]? Your HDD controller’s firmware [3]?

I acknowledge that I’m advancing something of a “slippery slope” argument here, but I still care about the question. Where do you draw the line? Obviously being able to audit all of it yourself perfectly would be awesome. But to me that just seems impossible. So how much is enough?

EDIT: beaten by astrodust!

[0] https://www.pcworld.com/article/2948092/security/hacking-tea...

[1] https://www.dcddcc.com/docs/2014_paper_microcode.pdf

[2] https://blog.exodusintel.com/2017/07/26/broadpwn/

[3] http://spritesmods.com/?art=hddhack&page=1

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conveniently, some parties like mostly Google but also Facebook and Twitter have both a big presence in the tracker space and also a site users often visit directly. Their information is going to get much more valuable.

Do Google ad tracking cookies actually live on the google.com domain? Seems like an ethical violation of some kind if so.

None of these changes really affect Google, since users typically use their services every day. It's almost like Apple is helping Google get more powerful. It's the smaller ad networks and exchanges that will suffer a lot.

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#75
You know who's not? B2B publishers. Because if this spreads, if you want to buy a niche market, you have to buy directly from that niche seller (for example, if you want to reach pig farmers, you'll need to buy ads on a pig farmer site -- it's the only way). So the ad networks hate it; direct sellers LOVE it.

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#76
post #53
post #31

> When Apple first announced the limitations to cross-website tracking in June, the company said the changes are meant to improve trust with users, explaining that “users feel that trust is broken when they are being tracked and privacy-sensitive data about their web activity is acquired for purposes that they never agreed to.” This! I switched from Windows+Android to the Apple ecosystem in 2015. Because I love so ma…

I wonder if Apple is protecting its customers from everyone except Apple. I really can't trust any closed-source OS, and very few closed-source applications.

[deleted]

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#77
post #3

Seems awesome. Hope Firefox does something similar.

Firefox's private browsing mode has been doing this for a while now, so they've got the tech in place and tested; I get the impression that they're waiting for other browsers to start the ball rolling on turning this on by default so that ad-supported websites don't just start outright blacklisting Firefox in retaliation. Safari doesn't have to worry about that, because of Apple's platform effect. Makes one wish that FirefoxOS worked out...

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#78
post #19

A translation of the open letter from advertising companies to Apple: September 14, 2017 We're just now realizing what this means. An Open Letter from the Digital Advertising Community "Community" means we're down to earth and neighborly. The undersigned organizations are leading trade associations for the digital advertising and marketing industries, collectively representing thousands of companies that responsibly…

Is there really that much money in online advertising? My impression was that they're all scrambling to protect their piece of a rapidly shrinking pie.

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#79
post #31

> When Apple first announced the limitations to cross-website tracking in June, the company said the changes are meant to improve trust with users, explaining that “users feel that trust is broken when they are being tracked and privacy-sensitive data about their web activity is acquired for purposes that they never agreed to.” This! I switched from Windows+Android to the Apple ecosystem in 2015. Because I love so ma…

This is nothing but a feel good PR spin on a replay of their not supporting Flash on the iPhone-- they want to force everyone into their evolving advertising ecosystem.

Apple could care less about the privacy of its users. https://www.cultofmac.com/230358/everything-you-need-to-know...

Re: Every Major Advertising Group Is Blasting Apple for Blocking Cookies in Safari

#80
post #34

If I understood the workings of the intelligent tracking prevention correctly ( https://webkit.org/blog/7675/intelligent-tracking-prevention... ) then this looks painful for ad networks which don't serve their ads from a domain with lots of organic traffic. Google and facebook should be fine given that lots of users go there at least once a month.

Actually though it blocks all the targeting. So, for example (and you can try it yourself now -- it's live in the High Sierra beta that you can download right now), when you go to Facebook, you will no longer see ads that are targeted to your interests/sites you've visited. Facebook makes it's money off of ads that are personalized -- generic ads don't sell. Same with Google's Ad network -- it's targeting you based on demos that it will no longer be able to track. Yes, Apple may be protecting its users but this is a direct hit at Google and Facebook's ad revenues, particularly on mobile, where Safari has a much higher browser share. Download it yourself and try it out; it really is fascinating to see the difference.
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