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Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

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Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#71

Post by gred »

We need an updated Waldorf Statement [1].

"Members of the Node.js community deplore the action of the CTC men who have been cited for contempt by the Foundation board. We do not desire to prejudge their legal rights, but their actions have been a disservice to this project and have impaired their usefulness to the industry."

"We will forthwith discharge or suspend without compensation those in our employ, and will not re-employ any of these men until such a time as he is acquitted on Twitter or has purged himself of contempt and declares under oath that he is not a Meritocracist."

"On the broader issue of alleged sexist and non-inclusive elements in Silicon Valley, our members are likewise prepared to take positive action."

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldorf_Statement

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#72

Post by fatbird »

orless wrote: post #65
sulam wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This as least is something I can understand (and it seems he understands it too, as he apologized for it). When you're not involved in a discussion, are in a leadership position, and apologize to someone for the outcome of the discussion, you are undercutting the authority of the people involved in that discussion, the decision they made, and the entire organizational process that produced the decision.

Yes I get it that he may have stepped over other moderators, I can understand this. But how is that in violation with Code of Conduct, exactly? Just don't say it is "Other conduct which could reasonably be considered inappropriate in a professional setting". https://github.com/nodejs/TSC/blob/master/CODE_OF_CONDUCT.md

It's not a violation of the CoC, it undermines the CoC, which is generally inappropriate. It's basically broadcasting "Don't take the CoC seriously".

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#73

Post by mdekkers »

BinaryIdiot wrote: post #57
orless wrote: post #50

What I'm completely missing in this discussion of Code of Conduct violation is a specific list of which actions violated which clauses in this Code of Conduct. I see a list of complaints, but for an outsider it is really hard to follow why these actions are considered to be CoC violations. Take this, for instance: "In [moderation repository discussion], Rod’s first action was to apologize to a contributor who had bee…

This was how I viewed it as well. Especially if what Rod said about not being notified about ANY of these items is true. This just appears someone compiled a list of things Rod screwed up, most of which he seemed to own and tried to fix. Maybe my impression is wrong but it just comes off as awful. I tried getting the entire story. I tried reading through the complaints, hunting down tweets and even reading Rod's side…

it just comes off as awful

This is why have stopped contributing to OSS in a public fashion over 20 years ago. Nasty backstabbing politics (and in my case, there was actually a business purpose behind it, unlike most of this drama) People online are awful and the veil of anonymity and distance brings out the worst in people.

Fuck that.

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#74

Post by eric_b »

bhouston wrote: post #61

Too much drama and polemics. My god he spent a lot of time on that response -- like hours. If you are writing long emails dealing with responses to drama, you need to move on. Not because you are at fault but the whole situation is screwed up and not worth your time. This is not a win-win situation, but an everyone lose situation. It means you and others are in the muck. Once you get a bunch of these accusations and…

Was "Polemic" in your word of the day email or something?

Anyways, Rod's character is being assassinated on the internet. Prospective employers could Google his name and all they'll see is one side of things, unless he attempts to defend himself.

Additionally - the people wielding the pitchforks want him to just give up. At some point it's important for people to take a stand if they believe in their principles - or maybe I'm just old fashioned.

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#75

Post by nogbit »

Stratoscope wrote: post #16
thwd wrote: post #6

Shame how such a cool project as node.js can drown in political fingerpointing. The only measurement that counts (in my opinion) is cold hard code contributions.

It's a little extreme to say that cold hard code is the only thing that counts. Years ago I worked with someone who contributed more cold hard code than anyone else I've known. A brilliant developer, probably one of those "10X" people they talk about: that rare combination of outstanding technical chops and "get the job done" productivity. But more than once, he jumped into projects and features that he knew other pe…

Who was running that team? Blame should be on leadership for running an inefficient team where team members don't share and coordinate so that common projects, code, libs etc can be flushed out.

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#78

Post by mdekkers »

rdtsc wrote: post #67

It was pretty hard to discern what happened. A lot of text and veiled insinuations. He is how far I got: It was this article tweeted by Rod: http://quillette.com/2017/07/18/neurodiversity-case-free-spe... Which was noticed by a member of the community: https://twitter.com/captainsafia/status/887782785221615618 Does that describe it? Maybe someone has a more clear summary One thing I noticed is that Node.js community…

What is it about this community that seems to attract this kind of behavior?

I don't know about Node.js specifically, but I found when it is a project with a very high code-to-comms ration, this doesn't happen often. When there are a lot of non-coding "Open Source Groupies" involved in a project that start talking about "community engagement" and the like (or fledgling commercial entities, trying to cash in and influence), this shit isn't far behind.

Good open source code speaks for itself, and doesn't require non-code contributions. Or boards. Or a "Governance Structure".

Re: Rod Vagg's statement on the request to be removed from the Node.js CTC

#79

Post by nogbit »

jamescostian wrote: post #10
thwd wrote: post #6

Shame how such a cool project as node.js can drown in political fingerpointing. The only measurement that counts (in my opinion) is cold hard code contributions.

I fully agree that it sounds awful for a project to go down due to politics. But only paying attention to code reviews ignores how the community feels, as well as non-code work. For example, look at Rod Vagg's contributions to node: https://github.com/nodejs/node/commits?author=rvagg At least from the first page, it seems he's mostly working on documentation, specifically changelogs. But honestly, those changelogs ar…

Usually, one who writes change logs is part of leadership deciding what should be worked on next, strategy, prioritizing and often times accountability as well. This is because they have a birds eye view of everything that is being worked on. Not easy and often thankless.
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