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The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

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Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#71

What disturbs me most about this incident is how many people's first instinct, when faced with views they strongly disagree with, is to try and suppress those views and the person speaking them. Not to engage with the argument or to try and argue against it, just to shut the other person down. It's a totalitarian kind of response.

In my experience, most people who act like that lack the intelligence to make valid points in an argument or there are no good arguments that support their point of view.

I think a lot of this has to do with parenting. When crying always gets you everything, you don't learn to work hard or have a debate to get what you want. There's a whole generation of full-grown babies.

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#72
post #20

Not much new here. This article is essentially just re-affirming all the scientific statements that were already made in the original memo, backed by links to scientific studies. Only difference being that the author of this article has a PhD in sexual neuroscience (so people might have a harder time accusing her of not knowing what she's talking about) and is female (so some people might have a harder time of accusi…

> backed by links

> PhD in sexual neuroscience

> female

There's a LOT that's new here, relative to Damore's memo.

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#73

Welcome to the left. Where we are democratic, and suport free-speech, as long as agrees with our views. :)

Quite a dangerous falsehood to parrot. I am strongly critical of many of the more conservative values espoused by the practitioners of major religions in the US; their view on these matters do NOT agree with my own.

I will, however, fight for their right to express these views and practice their religion in my country (up until the point it infringes on another's rights).

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#74
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I could tell from the coverage (I couldn't get past the first few paragraphs of the memo), it asks for more diversity in terms of right-wing/conservative thinking, and for Google to stop encouraging women to apply. On the surface – that's asking for both more and less diversity, however Google rejects the idea that conservative views (that are compatible with Google's HR policies) are discouraged, which wou…

I would think the author would encourage women to apply, but discourage making interview pass rates biased towards one group or the other.

Interview pass criteria are not based on the gender/race of the candidate. The criteria are the same for all candidates for the same role. The goal of diversity/inclusion programs is to find more diverse candidates to interview in the first place.

Edit: referring to Google specifically

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#75
> But sexism isn’t the result of knowing facts; it’s the result of what people choose to do with them.

We know that men are taller than women. I can see you agreeing, but actually this statement is ambiguous, because these two are not the same thing:

  A man is taller than a women

  On average, men are taller than women
Sexism is taking a random male and a random female, and claiming that despite all the facts presented to you, the male is taller than the female. It doesn't matter that in a specific case a female is taller than a male.

The same can be applied to any group and their respective stereotype. The *ism happens when we fail to assess an individual on the data given to us, preferring to fall back on mentally-lazy stereotypes/generalisations even when what we can see says something different.

   A single study, published in 2015, did claim that male
  and female brains existed along a “mosaic” and that it
  isn’t possible to differentiate them by sex, but this has
  been refuted by four – yes, four – academic studies since.

  This includes a study that analyzed the exact same brain
  data from the original study and found that the sex of a
  given brain could be correctly identified with 69-per-cent 
  to 77-per-cent accuracy.
Well I'd argue that isn't great accuracy as 50% is what you'd expect from chance (though I haven't read those references). In fact, I might expect a similar accuracy from a machine-learning technique to predict sex based on your height.

I haven't touched on the causes of population differences. With height, I don't think anyone thinks it's anything other than genetic (by way of testosterone levels). For interests and skills, the proportion that is caused by testosterone versus culture/environment is still unclear.

If we believe there is still a cultural effect, then I think positive discrimination is justified to counter this.

As an anecdote, we were wondering why our four-year old son suddenly lost interest in 'Frozen'. He told us this week that a girl had told him at nursery that 'Frozen' wasn't for boys. Cultural stereotype reinforcement is alive and well, and starts early!

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#76
Women work in the Berlin Post Office with calculators, 1928: http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-women-work-in-the-berlin-po...

The managers, a more people-oriented activity, are all men. But the people working with actual calculators are women. And it was not just this office, this was happening everywhere. Working with a calculator was a woman's job.

More: http://www.history.com/news/human-computers-women-at-nasa

There is a lot of factors to why STEM is dominated by men. Testosterone may be one, for real, but it is not the only one. And it doesn't justify such a big difference in numbers.

I don't know if the engineer wrote something awful or not, but this article is just a justification for the difference as if nothing can be done. And that is not true.

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#78

Welcome to the left. Where we are democratic, and suport free-speech, as long as agrees with our views. :)

I think you mean "Welcome to modern politics". Suppressing free speech you don't agree with is a time-tested tradition of most mainstream political thought. However, it's most disappointing to see from people you otherwise agree with.

In modern days, suppressing free speech is 90% a leftist thing.

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#79
post #20

Not much new here. This article is essentially just re-affirming all the scientific statements that were already made in the original memo, backed by links to scientific studies. Only difference being that the author of this article has a PhD in sexual neuroscience (so people might have a harder time accusing her of not knowing what she's talking about) and is female (so some people might have a harder time of accusi…

What astonishes me is that Google's VP of Diversity knows so little about the underlying science of her vocation that she confused statements of clinical fact (with the science even referenced in footnotes!) with personal attacks on women.

> gender studies

If I've learned anything, a "degree" in gender studies means one thing. It means that you are not a "Cis-gendered hetereosexual White Male".

Gender studies is a code-word for Women Studies. It's a bone to throw, to get "VP of Diversity and Hugbox" - and those groups are the ones to twist, lie, and deform anything you said because you're a threat. As long as you toe the line, you're usually relatively safe. If you speak out about the elephant, you are not to be discussed or engaged. You're to be blackballed, fired, and worse if they could.

And what those programs teach - they teach professional victimhood, professional weakness, and "Multiculturalism" in the sense of that you should hate Western Heteresexual White culture.

Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science

#80

Welcome to the left. Where we are democratic, and suport free-speech, as long as agrees with our views. :)

I flagged this comment because it's a low-quality political attack made in bad faith which can only serve to start a political flamewar.
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