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Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

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Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#71

Post by justifier »

This articles bothers me

Both the individual's story and her message here

I am glad it is here to bring further attention to these issues and even how this specific event happened to this woman

Both the encounter and how the police later handled the 'investigation' are both disgusting and why serious reform is anything but a top priority for officers and politicians is completely revolting to me

But I wish the author was more clear on what she meant in saying 'prevent the next philando castile'

Was she going to prevent it by filing the complaint and removing that officer from the street or was she insisting she would help prevent more philandos by educating others in saying:

> My behavior is how everyone should act in those situations: comply, survive and complain later.

Because Castile did comply and was still murdered

This clip discusses how the definition of 'comply' changes with each high profile murder

https://youtu.be/aufMdURbitU

Trevor Noah and the writers of the daily show have been discussing the issues in a way that I think has been highlighting some of the problems very clearly, and with great respect and composure

This clip calls out the silence from a leading voice defending law abiding citizens' rights to carry firearms, especially in regard to doing so without fear of being murdered by the police for carrying a firearm

https://youtu.be/0IJSSBMLz6g?t=250s

And this video showcases the newly released dashcam footage of the philando murder

https://youtu.be/wqgz7kRGVxg

We need to talk about these issues but insinuating blame on the victim is the wrong way to do it

I hope the article was actually focused on the prevention method of filing complaints but I wish that was more clear

So please, until this is solved, comply like Castile did and if you live to tell your side of the encounter then please report these offenders

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#72

Post by extra88 »

gozur88 wrote: post #30
apeace wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You didn't research very hard. From the Washington Post[0]: > White people make up roughly 62 percent of the U.S. population but only about 49 percent of those who are killed by police officers. African Americans, however, account for 24 percent of those fatally shot and killed by the police despite being just 13 percent of the U.S. population. As The Post noted in a new analysis published last week, that means black…

>White people make up roughly 62 percent of the U.S. population but only about 49 percent of those who are killed by police officers. African Americans, however, account for 24 percent of those fatally shot and killed by the police despite being just 13 percent of the U.S. population. Which is meaningless, since black people commit more serious crimes than white people. If you break it down by people suspected of hav…

> black people commit more serious crimes than white people.

Convicted? Yes. Arrested? Sure. Commit? I don't know, maybe, but I bet if you factored in economic status there'd be a lot of evening out; i.e. poor people commit more serious crimes, black people are disproportionately poor, therefore more black people commit more serious crimes.

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#73

Post by extra88 »

LyndsySimon wrote: post #61
bsder wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to have a set of cops who are clearly marked, wired with a body camera, and who don't carry weaponry . Put them in blaze orange or something so criminals can see them coming and run away. You should have to go through this period for some number of years until you get to carry a gun. Most cops go their whole lives without firing their gun--adding an extra gun rarely makes a situation better. While TV and movi…

I don't think the gun is the issue here - I carry a gun, regularly, and I've never felt the need to draw it and point it at someone who might be stealing something. Police in the US are generally seen as adversarial, while police in the UK are generally seen as mostly helpful. In my estimation, the problem in the US is one of culture. Police here are looking for a reason to charge you with a crime, not trying to keep…

> I carry a gun, regularly, and I've never felt the need to draw it and point it at someone who might be stealing something.

And yet you wrote in another comment that had you been the son-in-law, you would've brought your rifle to go talk to the person at the car. Why? In your scenario, you already called 911, what's the point of brandishing the weapon if you're not prepared to shoot someone for possibly stealing a car?

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#74

Post by extra88 »

LyndsySimon wrote: post #59
op00to wrote: post #5

How is property worth pointing a gun at someone over? It's a car. Cars can be replaced.

> How is property worth pointing a gun at someone over? Worth it or not, it's legal in some states and in some circumstances. I'm not sure about TN, where this occurred. > It's a car. Cars can be replaced. That car was purchased with money, which presumably was obtained through labor. Your labor, once expended, cannot be reclaimed. The moral argument can be made that theft of property is equivalent to theft of a port…

> The moral argument can be made that theft of property is equivalent to theft of a portion of one's life.

That's bullshit but even by that logic, killing the thief would not be a proportional response.

Plus most cars are insured to cover theft and since it was in the driveway, it possibly could have been covered by homeowner's insurance.

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#75

Post by weberc2 »

extra88 wrote: post #72
gozur88 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>White people make up roughly 62 percent of the U.S. population but only about 49 percent of those who are killed by police officers. African Americans, however, account for 24 percent of those fatally shot and killed by the police despite being just 13 percent of the U.S. population. Which is meaningless, since black people commit more serious crimes than white people. If you break it down by people suspected of hav…

> black people commit more serious crimes than white people. Convicted? Yes. Arrested? Sure. Commit? I don't know, maybe, but I bet if you factored in economic status there'd be a lot of evening out; i.e. poor people commit more serious crimes, black people are disproportionately poor, therefore more black people commit more serious crimes.

As I understand it, there's no real question about whether or not black Americans commit more crime than other races (the data are all consistent, including that collected from victims and witnesses), but SES alone doesn't explain the gap IIRC. I suspect it has to do with the relative concentration of poverty, but that's just a hunch and I doubt it's all down to one simple factor anyway.

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#76

Post by akytt »

LyndsySimon wrote: post #61
bsder wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need to have a set of cops who are clearly marked, wired with a body camera, and who don't carry weaponry . Put them in blaze orange or something so criminals can see them coming and run away. You should have to go through this period for some number of years until you get to carry a gun. Most cops go their whole lives without firing their gun--adding an extra gun rarely makes a situation better. While TV and movi…

I don't think the gun is the issue here - I carry a gun, regularly, and I've never felt the need to draw it and point it at someone who might be stealing something. Police in the US are generally seen as adversarial, while police in the UK are generally seen as mostly helpful. In my estimation, the problem in the US is one of culture. Police here are looking for a reason to charge you with a crime, not trying to keep…

The issue that the police in UK fire their guns a few orders of magnitude less might have something to do with it. It makes no sense to dive into statistics as to encounters and guilt and race and what not. Police in US is seen as adversial because they tend to shoot people and that's the core problem. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-police-sho...

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#77

Post by akytt »

sturgeongeneral wrote: post #28
op00to wrote: post #5

How is property worth pointing a gun at someone over? It's a car. Cars can be replaced.

It may be just a car to you, but I have a valuable sports car, and if I caught someone attempting to steal it I wouldn't hesitate to point a gun. Not for a moment. Would the intent be to kill? Of course not. It'd be to deter. Edit for the downvotes: it's not just a car to me, and it's not just about the monetary value. It has sentimental value and I wouldn't be able to replace it easily. I don't see what's so controv…

Now that's a culture thing. I've always been taught never to pull a gun unless you are ready to shoot someone. That's why I don't have one.

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#79

Post by Hnrobert42 »

weberc2 wrote: post #46
3JPLW wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then in that case, I suppose it all depends on who is doing the justification. Nearly every police shooting in America is "justified" — be it by a police review board, a prosecutor, a grand jury, or a trial jury.

I agree, and unfortunately I don't have a good idea about how to audit the entire justice system. My gut says it's unlikely that an entire diverse industry is prejudiced against one particular racial group, and that thousands of laypeople are in on it. Hopefully we can get better data if it doesn't already exist.

You think it unlikely that there is a systemic bias? Bearing in mind that systemic bias isn't usually the result of an overt plan or even hidden conspiracy but instead the simple average of the bias of all the parts of the system.

Re: Lifesaving advice from a black woman held at gunpoint by police

#80

Post by mnm1 »

sturgeongeneral wrote: post #58
pmiller2 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no such thing as pointing a firearm to "deter." One of the basic tenets of firearm training is that you never point it at anything you don't intend to shoot. And, when shooting, always go for a center mass shot. "Winging" someone is neither practical nor probable.

Of course there is, but yes, I accept the lethal outcome.

If you mean murder, don't say 'deter' and then wonder why you're getting downvoted.
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