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David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

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Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#71

Post by pgodzin »

throwaway-1209 wrote: post #69
pgodzin wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A woman with a perspective on the diversity and culture they need to create seems uniquely qualified for the role.

"Diversity hiring" is a double edged sword though. There's a stigma attached to it which is really hard to overcome even if you're good.

It's crazy that hiring a woman to be the second woman on a board is considered "diversity hiring" though. It's not a super minority that is being looked for to tout diversity, it's half the population! I'm sure there are women who are both utterly qualified AND can provide a perspective on the more inclusive culture they are trying to create.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#72

Post by [deleted] »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #59
threeseed wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is the theory. And there is the reality. The theory says it shouldn't matter who you are it should only be based on your professional ability. And in theory it wouldn't make a difference to the ability of a company to function whether the gender or racial mix was one sided or not. The reality is different. The reality is that having a uniform gender and race mix across a company causes all sorts of problems to…

How does this reality , this idea that companies are dysfunctional if gender and race are uniform, fit the data of the previous few thousand years of human progress? Has the world changed? Can groups of uniform gender-race people no longer act cordially to people who aren't same gender-race?

[deleted]

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#73

Post by tmalsburg2 »

pgodzin wrote: post #21
initstick wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FTFY: He needs to be replaced by a more qualified individual. It doesn't matter what gender they identify as.

A woman with a perspective on the diversity and culture they need to create seems uniquely qualified for the role.

Replacing Bonderman with "a woman" will not magically solve issues around sexism. There is quite a bit of research, for instance on academic hiring, showing that women often have the same or at least similar sexist biases against women as men. See also the research on implicit stereotypes showing that both men and women associate men with traits related to strength and power and women with traits related to weakness. A female board member would probably not make stupid comments like Bonderman's but that alone is not going to change the toxic culture at Uber.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#74

Post by throwaway-1209 »

pgodzin wrote: post #71
throwaway-1209 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Diversity hiring" is a double edged sword though. There's a stigma attached to it which is really hard to overcome even if you're good.

It's crazy that hiring a woman to be the second woman on a board is considered "diversity hiring" though. It's not a super minority that is being looked for to tout diversity, it's half the population! I'm sure there are women who are both utterly qualified AND can provide a perspective on the more inclusive culture they are trying to create.

Hiring a woman is not crazy in the least. Hiring a woman because she's a woman over a more qualified male candidate (or the other way around) is harmful. There are plenty of women who don't need such "help".

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#75

Post by pgodzin »

tmalsburg2 wrote: post #73
pgodzin wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A woman with a perspective on the diversity and culture they need to create seems uniquely qualified for the role.

Replacing Bonderman with "a woman" will not magically solve issues around sexism. There is quite a bit of research, for instance on academic hiring, showing that women often have the same or at least similar sexist biases against women as men. See also the research on implicit stereotypes showing that both men and women associate men with traits related to strength and power and women with traits related to weakness.…

Not sure what straw man you are arguing against, certainly never said it would "magically solve issues around sexism" or that "alone" is "enough to change the toxic culture".

We are talking about the role of board member - which comes with the impact of immediately being one of the most powerful and influential voices within Uber. Bonderman's voice spoke volumes today about the culture the company previously condoned, and a new female board member could potentially have a far greater positive impact promoting a more inclusive culture. By definition, one person can't change a company culture, but could set an example and set the ball rolling.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#76

Post by pgodzin »

throwaway-1209 wrote: post #74
pgodzin wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's crazy that hiring a woman to be the second woman on a board is considered "diversity hiring" though. It's not a super minority that is being looked for to tout diversity, it's half the population! I'm sure there are women who are both utterly qualified AND can provide a perspective on the more inclusive culture they are trying to create.

Hiring a woman is not crazy in the least. Hiring a woman because she's a woman over a more qualified male candidate (or the other way around) is harmful. There are plenty of women who don't need such "help".

Not sure why we immediately need to jump to the trope that a more qualified male candidate would be passed over. You're treating a seat on the board as if were some sort of technical role with hard skills. It's not - it's a role to be a positive and influential voice within a company dealing with a toxic culture. Being a successful woman and having all the experiences and perspectives that come with that is literally part of their qualification for the position.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#77

Post by pgodzin »

nawre wrote: post #28
dbnoch wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I understand the sentiment... it DOES matter what gender they identify as. Uber's culture issues deal with sexism and harassment towards Women. You need a diverse group for the board and adding white males will not fix their issue.

>You need a diverse group for the board and adding white males will not fix their issue. It was of paramount importance to mention skin colour here. I don't understand so-called progressives like you. Do you understand that just because you have a spectrum of skin colours, or genders, does not mean you have actual diversity. That socio-economic backgrounds weights a lot more than this, and that you can have a board o…

When it comes to board seats there's only one socio-economic background that matters.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#78

Post by tmalsburg2 »

pgodzin wrote: post #75
tmalsburg2 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Replacing Bonderman with "a woman" will not magically solve issues around sexism. There is quite a bit of research, for instance on academic hiring, showing that women often have the same or at least similar sexist biases against women as men. See also the research on implicit stereotypes showing that both men and women associate men with traits related to strength and power and women with traits related to weakness.…

Not sure what straw man you are arguing against, certainly never said it would "magically solve issues around sexism" or that "alone" is "enough to change the toxic culture". We are talking about the role of board member - which comes with the impact of immediately being one of the most powerful and influential voices within Uber. Bonderman's voice spoke volumes today about the culture the company previously condoned…

Sorry, my previous comment wasn't clear enough. Perhaps I misunderstood you, but you seemed to suggest that being female would uniquely qualify a new board member to promote a more diverse and inclusive culture. The research that I referred to suggests that this may not be the case or at least not as much as you might think.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#79

Post by cthulha »

hashmymustache wrote: post #55

It seems like teachable moments have become fireable offenses. I understand the seriousness of the issue and context, but is this really worth the level of outrage it has received? Edit: Curious at the downvotes for an honest attempt at a reasonable discussion on the issue. Such are the times.

Calling this a 'teachable moment' is really letting the person off the hook for observing and learning up before now.

If he hasn't learned by now what is appropriate behaviour, why do you think he'll ever learn?

And if he doesn't learn rapidly and advance with best practices in corporate culture and governance, then he's not capable of the leadership and management responsibilities of a board member.

The 'teachable moments' were at least 3 years ago, if not much earlier. The firing offence is ignoring them.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#80

Post by throwaway-1209 »

pgodzin wrote: post #76
throwaway-1209 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hiring a woman is not crazy in the least. Hiring a woman because she's a woman over a more qualified male candidate (or the other way around) is harmful. There are plenty of women who don't need such "help".

Not sure why we immediately need to jump to the trope that a more qualified male candidate would be passed over. You're treating a seat on the board as if were some sort of technical role with hard skills. It's not - it's a role to be a positive and influential voice within a company dealing with a toxic culture. Being a successful woman and having all the experiences and perspectives that come with that is literally…

I did nothing of the sort. You're trying to put words in my mouth, and I don't play these kinds of games. Bye.
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