Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

qz.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 87 posts

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#71

Post by pimmen89 »

en3rme wrote: post #49
godzilla82 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are the products of your "local economy" sold locally. If not, then you have no right to claim protection.

People don't want what's fair, people want what's better for them. I don't want my wage to lower just so people in the third world can live better because I, honestly, don't give a fuck about them. That's the sentiment that's rising lately.

And this is where the tribalism comes in to play. At some point, governments have to do what's fair and not what the angry mob they represents want. White Europeans might've wanted colonialism hundreds of years ago, and to this day some people don't really care when their military commits war crimes against "them".

It's hard for me to sympathise with the view that "the real unfairness here is that people born in miserable conditions are happy to do my job for less, so I'm the victim here".

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#72

Post by pimmen89 »

JetSpiegel wrote: post #61
sanswork wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they didn't want a corporate owned shill why did they elect a corporate shill? >where low cost workers from overseas work at every single Tim Hortons. This isn't reality I think you need to check your information sources.

Trump shills for himself, while the others are much more nebulous.

We have to take it on faith because we have no tax returns to check who he owns money too.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#73

Post by rishabhsagar »

golergka wrote: post #60
plaban123 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bad "Indian code" is what the client is paying for. If you pay 1/10th of American salary to recruit developers in India who are at the bottom of the stack in terms of competency, what are you expecting?. Everything is magnified in India because of the population. We have bad coders to CEOs of American corporations. But this works as well. Thats why TCS, Infosys, etc are billionaire dollar enterprises.

Outsourcing companies in Ukraine or Russia don't have the same problem.

That is not because Ukraine and Russia don't have bad (hence cheap) IT staff.

It has more to do with IT resources from India generally tend to be the sweet spot of cheap enough and good enough (for a cheapskate, penny foolish myopic offshoring companies) resources.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#74

Post by rishabhsagar »

la_oveja wrote: post #43
aub3bhat wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on what general reputation of incompetence? Just take a look at proportion of indians at top engineering and management positions in Tech Companies. This "meme" is nothing but some racist stereotype pushed by old commenters on Slashdot style website who paint themselves to be next turing award material. Guess what the Market never lies and you get what you pay for! Those who pay the best/most still have large nu…

Call it whatever you want, the average indian github account has some of the weirdest shit I've ever seen. Saving stuff to txt instead of database, make download 500kb json on each login, callback hell... I'm sure a proper indian engineer wont do this stuff, but the quantity of indian people who make bad code (and bad english) amazes me.

"Saving stuff to txt instead of database, make download 500kb json on each login, callback hell"

>> Are you sure you are not suffering from observational bias or some fallacy? With a shit colored lens, I can replicate the same observation for almost any other nationality.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#75

Post by letitgo12345 »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #37
letitgo12345 wrote: post #7

While many Indians seeking employment abroad are impacted a lot by these changes, I don't think the sentiment behind these changes has much to do with Indian people per se. There's a global backlash against too much immigration in general. Indians are just caught in the mix.

I disagree. At least here in New Zealand, there's a subtle racist undertone, you never hear people complaining about all the Europeans arriving. People conveniently ignore the fact that we receive as many immigrants from Europe as from Asia (including India but excluding the Middle East).

Not denying racist undertones. But I think then a more accurate headline would be "Non-white techies not wanted" rather than just Indian. But for example, backlash in US is because of illegal hispanic immigration (there's some anti-Indian H1B related stuff as well tho some of the anger at H1B is not without reason). In the UK it's fear of non-white and EU immigration (ex. the polish plumber stereotype). In France and most of Europe, it's fear of Muslim immigration. In all cases, as far as I can tell, it's low skilled mass immigration that's driving the anxiety. So I think the causes and far more complex and it's problematic to think of it as just an anti-Indian techie backlash.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#76

Post by contingencies »

I met an Aussie guy here in Shenzhen this week who is quite wealthy indeed and who actually wants to spend money to bring some manufacturing to Australia from China.

Unfortunately, he can't get a visa for the one (Chinese) employee who really needs it (to plan out the factory and begin many million dollars of investment), and can't get a reason why out of the immigration department. Nobody in Australia can do the job because they don't have experience with current gear (Australian manufacturing is today basically a few specialist, legacy facilities and some defense-related stuff only) and it's only documented in Chinese.

Because the guy is wealthy and well connected and Australia is a small place, he managed to get some phone calls directly with the Immigration Minister, Mr. D., who essentially said "re-apply, I can't do anything". Meanwhile, the target region (with no jobs) has lost 200 planned jobs (including 30% committed to be allocated to disabled workers, and others likely to be allocated to challenged demographics such as aged workers) and the significant accompanying economic stimulation from the planned facility, and the guy is paying 10s of 1000s a month in opportunity costs. True story, this week.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#77

Post by superasn »

pkaye wrote: post #8
superasn wrote: post #4

Being an Indian engineer myself the funniest part is that regardless of your branch/stream almost every person in my college got an IT job (your branch is decided by the entrance test). We had a saying about TCS in our college "trespassers will be recruited". And they asked chemical engineering and GK questions during the placement tests. It was so weird when I think about it now.

What are examples are branch/stream? Are they just different engineering majors like Civil, Chemical, Mechanical?

Yes that is exactly it.

Competition is really fierce in Indian engineering colleges. The ratio is 1 out 10K (or something similar) for getting into good colleges so you end up picking any branch you can get.

I'm not sure how it is in other countries though.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#78

Post by pkaye »

superasn wrote: post #77
pkaye wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are examples are branch/stream? Are they just different engineering majors like Civil, Chemical, Mechanical?

Yes that is exactly it. Competition is really fierce in Indian engineering colleges. The ratio is 1 out 10K (or something similar) for getting into good colleges so you end up picking any branch you can get. I'm not sure how it is in other countries though.

Kind of the same in the US. Some majors are "impacted" which means tougher to get in due to heavy demand. Computer science/engineering used to be tough to get into even 20 years back before the internet became popular.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#79

Post by LukaEn »

bmon wrote: post #38
posguy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are tired of the corporate owned politicians allowing companies to run roughshod over the laws, morals & expectations of society. This is expressed in many ways, from xenophobia to the rise of Bernie Sanders & Donald Trump. People don't want another corporate owned shill like either of the Clintons, both Bushes, and Obama, and I'd wager that Obama knew this in 2008, hence why he made sure his moderately grassr…

This is satire right? I'm struggling to see how obama rates as corporate shill while trump is somehow an angel...

People may view them as such. Trump fans seem to think of him as a anti establishment figure.

Re: Countries that are reducing numbers of immigrant workers

#80

Post by ashwinaj »

newsat13 wrote: post #10

I hope the India govt moves fast now. The should take this opportunity to improve local infrastructure and put in reforms for a domestic software economy. The TCS, Infosys & Wipro helped kickstart the software revolution in India but they need to take this to a better conclusion than it is now. We need product based companies in India and we need a strong local domestic market. It needs to retain it's talent at home.…

Maybe I'm cynical, but I don't see how India can move from a services/back office economy to product development until expats with such experience move back. Our education quality is pathetically dismal, infrastructure within cities needs improvement, red tape needs to go etc. We don't have enough risk takers and many of us are risk averse.

I think the key is convincing expats to come back, which is hard.

Post reply on HN