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Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

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Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#71

Post by khedoros1 »

to3m wrote: post #60
kbenson wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I understand for the general public, and I wasn't trying to imply there's no place for the new consoles, just that I figure most the people reading HN could probably get away with putting that money towards their main computer platform more effectively. That does, of course, assume mostly single use, and that's a rather large caveat I didn't cover. I have three kids, and for a set-top box, ease of use is extrem…

I'd have expected most people to have a laptop at home. Maybe I'm unusual, or maybe the people I know are unusual, but I don't know many who use a desktop PC at home any more. Desktop work PCs are still common, but you're not going to spend your own money on them.

I don't know many, either. Even mine has been sitting idle for a while, because it's in my (toddler) son's room, I don't have anywhere else to put it, and it's honestly begging for an upgrade at this point anyhow.

Which is too bad. It's got a nicer keyboard+mouse, sound system, screen, storage, network connection, and graphics than my laptop. There's a dedicated desk and chair. The only place the laptop wins out: Convenience.

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#72

Post by [deleted] »

hsod wrote: post #69
zaroth wrote: post #51

What they really need to do is maybe just start completely over on the whole Xbox Dashboard. For something that could be so simple and easy, the whole experience of trying to use the Xbox for anything other than playing a game is insanely frustrating. Every time I sit down to try to use it I'm just tearing my hair out! It's been, what, over a decade they've been working on that Dashboard and it has always been just a…

My #1 UX issue is that it makes me manually sign into my profile every time I turn it on, which is a clunky and overlong process, even though I only have one profile and I ALWAYS use it.

[deleted]

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#73

Post by LynxInLA »

hsod wrote: post #69
zaroth wrote: post #51

What they really need to do is maybe just start completely over on the whole Xbox Dashboard. For something that could be so simple and easy, the whole experience of trying to use the Xbox for anything other than playing a game is insanely frustrating. Every time I sit down to try to use it I'm just tearing my hair out! It's been, what, over a decade they've been working on that Dashboard and it has always been just a…

My #1 UX issue is that it makes me manually sign into my profile every time I turn it on, which is a clunky and overlong process, even though I only have one profile and I ALWAYS use it.

Do you have "Instant sign-in" turned on for that profile? I've never had an issue with that.

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#74

Post by kbenson »

to3m wrote: post #60
kbenson wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I understand for the general public, and I wasn't trying to imply there's no place for the new consoles, just that I figure most the people reading HN could probably get away with putting that money towards their main computer platform more effectively. That does, of course, assume mostly single use, and that's a rather large caveat I didn't cover. I have three kids, and for a set-top box, ease of use is extrem…

I'd have expected most people to have a laptop at home. Maybe I'm unusual, or maybe the people I know are unusual, but I don't know many who use a desktop PC at home any more. Desktop work PCs are still common, but you're not going to spend your own money on them.

I have a home workstation because I do a lot of work from home. Working from a laptop is a sub-par experience because of the form factor. Right now, I'm using a Dell XPS 15 laptop at home, but it's docked to a desktop keyboard and mouse, and a 40" 4K TV I use as a monitor. Prior to the laptop (which I almost never move, bit like that I can if needed take with me), I had a desktop at the same desk. So, right how I'msort of hybrid, but prior to that I had a desktop at home (and a separate, older laptop that I almost never used).

As for "most people", it's important to consider different types of situations, such as families in which there might be a shared computer, or a desktop in the room of one or more children because it's sometimes more economical.

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#75

Post by shmed »

kbenson wrote: post #33
snuxoll wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you own a PS4 or an X1 and the money to buy a PS4 Pro or Scorpio, it seems like the best move is to buy the upgrade of the platform you don't have. Then you've got access to both platforms' exclusives, and at least one new-spec machine for the games that aren't exclusive. As someone who owns both consoles, after seeing the lack of enthusiasm at the PS4 Pro launch event I decided to hold off until Scorpio specs b…

> From here on out, expect new hardware every couple years that will be compatible with your existing library So, basically a computer, but limited, and a lower bar to entry. I understand the use case for those that might not have a traditional computer or a very old one, but presumably everyone here would be better served by either shelling out an extra $100-$200 every couple years for a better video card in their l…

You'll never get the same performance for the same cost on PC. They showed forza horizon 3 running at 60 FPS/4k on the scorpio, in a stress test with wheather effect + the maximum amount of cars on screen, while only using 66% of the available GPU power. And that was on a version of forza that was not even yet optimized for the scorpio, all they did was spend 2 day updating the engine to run on scorpio. I'm not sure how much the scorpio will cost, but the NVidia 1070 struggle at running forza horizon 3 at 4k at over 50 fps. Getting anything more than a 1070 will likely cost you close to the price of the scorpio just for the GPU.

Specs to specs, PC would seem like a good deal for the price, but with all the optimization that goes into tweaking consoles to make them perform better on games, its rarely the case for a PC to outperform a console for the same price. For example, they announced a hardware implementation of DX12 into scorpio, which isn't available on PC yet. We don't know how much this will affect performance, but its the kind of things that plays in favor of consoles.

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#76

Post by mustacheemperor »

mikestew wrote: post #66
zaroth wrote: post #51

What they really need to do is maybe just start completely over on the whole Xbox Dashboard. For something that could be so simple and easy, the whole experience of trying to use the Xbox for anything other than playing a game is insanely frustrating. Every time I sit down to try to use it I'm just tearing my hair out! It's been, what, over a decade they've been working on that Dashboard and it has always been just a…

I really don't understand how they have millions of users and so much basic shit Just Doesn't Work. Because those millions of users use the box to play games, like I do. Oh, I've tried all the other stuff, and as you point out it's generally such a steaming pile of shit that I feel foolish for having even tried. (If the Kinect weren't in a box in the garage, I'd be staring in its direction right now.) Frankly, I'd be…

>I'd be happy if they could just bring the Xbone back to the level of usability that the 360 had

My housemates and I purchased an Xbone and realized before long we were using the 360 more because it was vastly preferable for netflix/youtube/etc. Have since switched to a chromecast for that stuff, but the Xbone is absolutely a massive step back in UX. Not to mention the ads on the dashboard. There is advertising on the dashboard of my $250 console, that requires a paid subscription for online play. Why is that acceptable?

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#77

Post by blisse »

markdog12 wrote: post #65
pwthornton wrote: post #61

I hope this is more than just putting out 4k games. Most people don't have 4k TVs, and, very importantly, for those that do, most don't have a big enough one for how far away they sit. I'm thinking of upgrading to a 65-inch OLED this year, and from my couch of about 10 feet away (maybe a hair closer), I won't be able to tell 1080p from 4k. And that's a pretty big TV! I would much rather see Scorpio games at 1080/60 f…

This must be highly subjective, because for me, 65" 4k tv 10' away is like night and day to me compared to 1080p

There's no difference side-by-side between 1080p and 4K resolution if you're 5ft or further away from the TV[1], all else being equal.

However, all else is rarely equal, and 4K TVs now have lots of other features and technology that make them just better (prettier) buys in general.

[1] http://s3.carltonbale.com/resolution_chart.html

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#78

Post by kbenson »

shmed wrote: post #75
kbenson wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From here on out, expect new hardware every couple years that will be compatible with your existing library So, basically a computer, but limited, and a lower bar to entry. I understand the use case for those that might not have a traditional computer or a very old one, but presumably everyone here would be better served by either shelling out an extra $100-$200 every couple years for a better video card in their l…

You'll never get the same performance for the same cost on PC. They showed forza horizon 3 running at 60 FPS/4k on the scorpio, in a stress test with wheather effect + the maximum amount of cars on screen, while only using 66% of the available GPU power. And that was on a version of forza that was not even yet optimized for the scorpio, all they did was spend 2 day updating the engine to run on scorpio. I'm not sure…

> You'll never get the same performance for the same cost on PC.

In a direct from-nothing-to-full-system comparison, sure. But if you've got a desktop already, your costs might just be the Nvidia card, and maybe some more RAM if that's lacking. Newegg has Nvidia 1070 cards that advertise DX12 for $370. It looks like a 1080 will cost about the same as I imagine the Xbox refresh will cost for about 15%-20% more power. By the time this is actually released, a good 6+ months from now, I imagine those prices will probably be much better.

That's not the only thing that matters of course, but there are benefits to updating your general purpose machine, in that you might make use of that extra power in other ways (e.g. extra RAM making the system more performant in general, not just for games).

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#79

Post by pwthornton »

markdog12 wrote: post #65
pwthornton wrote: post #61

I hope this is more than just putting out 4k games. Most people don't have 4k TVs, and, very importantly, for those that do, most don't have a big enough one for how far away they sit. I'm thinking of upgrading to a 65-inch OLED this year, and from my couch of about 10 feet away (maybe a hair closer), I won't be able to tell 1080p from 4k. And that's a pretty big TV! I would much rather see Scorpio games at 1080/60 f…

This must be highly subjective, because for me, 65" 4k tv 10' away is like night and day to me compared to 1080p

At least with the 4k OLEDs, you are also getting HDR, way better contrast ratio, better colors, etc. So, you'll notice that, even if you don't notice the resolution difference.

I am excited to see Xbox support HDR. I just hate to see all of this extra hardware dedicated to resolution, when there are so many things that it could be put to.

Re: Inside the next Xbox: Project Scorpio tech revealed

#80

Post by trashcan »

hsod wrote: post #69
zaroth wrote: post #51

What they really need to do is maybe just start completely over on the whole Xbox Dashboard. For something that could be so simple and easy, the whole experience of trying to use the Xbox for anything other than playing a game is insanely frustrating. Every time I sit down to try to use it I'm just tearing my hair out! It's been, what, over a decade they've been working on that Dashboard and it has always been just a…

My #1 UX issue is that it makes me manually sign into my profile every time I turn it on, which is a clunky and overlong process, even though I only have one profile and I ALWAYS use it.

How to fix that: http://support.xbox.com/en-US/my-account/manage-account/chan...
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