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PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

nytimes.com

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Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#71

Post by jliptzin »

aleksandrm wrote: post #22
paulmd wrote: post #11

Remember when in the aftermath of Katrina, Paypal seized donations fundraised from Something Awful intended for the Red Cross for "fraud" and then refused to release them even when everyone told them they knew full well what was going on? After they got called onto the mat they finally agreed to release the funds but only to one of their own selected list of charities, all of which had vastly greater overhead expense…

PayPal is a nightmarish company. I've lost ~3000 USD to PayPal when I was doing small business back in early 2000s. Their "buyer first" policy had screwed us big time, even though we have provided all the documentation to contest the bogus claims. PayPal froze our money, and terrorized me for a whole year with collections agencies. It was awful. I am out of 3K dollars, and I have stopped using PayPal since.

Same here, about $2,000 they claim I owe them because they stupidly decided to refund money to an obvious scammer. Luckily I had already withdrawn the money. This happened when I was 15 and since then I am banned for life from Paypal - every time I tried opening up a new account they would eventually ban me. However during the last 15 years I have started multiple successful businesses and used alternatives like Stripe instead of Paypal and they are missing out on literally hundreds of thousands of dollars in fees.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#72

Post by jaredchung »

bostand wrote: post #34

Paypal is evil, but what are the alternatives? AliPay? WebMoney? Bitcoin??

If we're talking about alternatives for giving money to a charity, I strongly recommend opening up the contact page of your preferred charity, calling them and just asking them what method they would prefer for you to send them money. Charities often have preferences that allow them to save money on transaction fees. For example they might have a discounted rate with a particular credit card company or prefer a physical check, or want you to pass it through a fiscal sponsor. Especially for small charities -- donors are the lifeblood of charities, so they will bend over backwards to help you give!

Source: I run a charity.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#73

Post by ptaipale »

tokenizerrr wrote: post #65
ptaipale wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the parent said that Paypal is nice and good in Europe. It merely said that they might be under a stricter regulatory control in Europe, so unhappy customers have more tools available to keep them to account. [Edit/add]: However, American citizens have often stronger tools available in class action suites. EU countries trust the authorities, and it is then up to officials to control parties like Paypal.…

Except class action lawsuits get you absolutely nothing unless you are a lawyer. Enjoy that voucher for a free pancake, only redeemable between 4.30 and 4.32 AM at a single restaurant.

But at least they can be started and participated by individual citizens.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#74

Post by sedachv »

tokenizerrr wrote: post #65
ptaipale wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the parent said that Paypal is nice and good in Europe. It merely said that they might be under a stricter regulatory control in Europe, so unhappy customers have more tools available to keep them to account. [Edit/add]: However, American citizens have often stronger tools available in class action suites. EU countries trust the authorities, and it is then up to officials to control parties like Paypal.…

Except class action lawsuits get you absolutely nothing unless you are a lawyer. Enjoy that voucher for a free pancake, only redeemable between 4.30 and 4.32 AM at a single restaurant.

As an individual consumer you are very likely to shrug off small losses because of a company acting in bad faith and move on. It is not worth your time. The management of an individual company has a large incentive for acting in bad faith because the aggregate profits from ripping off many consumers can be large. Class-action lawsuits are expensive for the company being sued and act as an effective deterrent to bad behavior, and are one of the very few ways for consumer collective action under a capitalist system.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#75

Post by intopieces »

They picked the perfect plaintiff to lead this fight. A woman who did her due dilligence -- compared PayPal's website to the charity websites, donated a significant amount of money, then followed up with those donations. Unless PayPal can prove they repeatedly attempted to disburse the money to the charities by encouraging them to open an account, I don't see how PayPal can come out on top with this one.

Truly a garbage company.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#76

Post by mikeash »

nannePOPI wrote: post #60

If a human were to do something like this he would get prison time. Instead since it has been done by "a company", nothing will be done. I wish we, the humanity, would start to treat limited liability only as a financial tool. If something like this is done, it's not the company that must be sued, but the people who made it.

Maybe companies should be "imprisoned" as well for things like this. Obviously you can't actually put them in prison, but you could force them to cease operations for a period of time, which is effectively what you do to a person when you imprison them.

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#77

Post by bostand »

jaredchung wrote: post #72
bostand wrote: post #34

Paypal is evil, but what are the alternatives? AliPay? WebMoney? Bitcoin??

If we're talking about alternatives for giving money to a charity, I strongly recommend opening up the contact page of your preferred charity, calling them and just asking them what method they would prefer for you to send them money. Charities often have preferences that allow them to save money on transaction fees. For example they might have a discounted rate with a particular credit card company or prefer a physi…

actually, I meant pay for stuff online in general...

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#78

Post by bostand »

driverdan wrote: post #55
bostand wrote: post #34

Paypal is evil, but what are the alternatives? AliPay? WebMoney? Bitcoin??

Bitcoin is great. For people who don't use Bitcoin I use Square Cash or Venmo (owned by PayPal).

Bitcoin is great but

1. It's just too volatile

2. I can't pay most sellers on eBay and Amazon with bitcoins, but everyone takes paypal

Re: PayPal Redirects Charitable Contributions Without Consent, Lawsuit Says

#80

Post by greenyoda »

mikeash wrote: post #76
nannePOPI wrote: post #60

If a human were to do something like this he would get prison time. Instead since it has been done by "a company", nothing will be done. I wish we, the humanity, would start to treat limited liability only as a financial tool. If something like this is done, it's not the company that must be sued, but the people who made it.

Maybe companies should be "imprisoned" as well for things like this. Obviously you can't actually put them in prison, but you could force them to cease operations for a period of time, which is effectively what you do to a person when you imprison them.

Unfortunately, this also hurts the employees of the company, most of whom had no connection to the criminal act. I'd rather hold the decision-makers who perpetrated the crime personally responsible.
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