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Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

darkpatterns.org

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Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#71

Post by notatoad »

Animats wrote: post #29
sethbannon wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's the one of the most egregious examples of LinkedIn's dark UX. The transition from "I'm accepting incoming invites" to "I'm inviting people to connect or join LinkedIn" is intentionally subtle: https://goo.gl/photos/ncnTiMWeSBJfg3rZ6

That link itself is a dark pattern. It tries to get you to sign into Google; you can't see the photos otherwise.

If it were truly the case that you couldn't see it without signing in, that would not be a dark pattern - there's nothing misleading about that, it's just a policy you don't like. using the buzzword of the moment to criticize something you don't like, without considering whether it really applies, is how phrases lose all their meaning.

(of course, that's not true here and you don't have to sign in)

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#72

Post by alphapapa »

soared wrote: post #18
cs702 wrote: post #15

Great video and great website. My only nitpick: the author wants the industry to agree on a "code of ethics." Unfortunately, such exhortations strike me as naive. They are unlikely to work, because the truly bad actors will continue to use dark patterns regardless, putting pressure on all other actors to follow suit. The key challenge is not in getting the good actors to do the right thing, but in preventing the bad…

I agree and that goal sounds similar to the goal of Kill Analytics [1]. "The industry" doesn't even exist as an entity. Gov regulation seems like the only viable way to fix it. But on the other hand, Google AdSense has done a lot to improve advertising online. Popups and bad ads used to be waaay worse than they are now (not that they are okay now). So maybe we do just need a few big players to step up and change thin…

> Gov regulation seems like the only viable way to fix it.

So we can have more "This website uses cookies, okay?!?!?" banners popping up all over the place? No thanks.

Besides, do you really want a bureaucrat telling you how to design your web site, with penalties enforceable by law?

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#75

Post by gnicholas »

An oft-overlooked aspect of dark patterns is the impact on accessibility.

Ever received a spam email, hunted for the unsubscribe link, and found it in light grey, against a white background? Imagine how much worse that is for someone with low vision. Ditto for pop-up ads with a tiny grey X in the corner.

Many of the dark patterns described in the video rely on hiding/obfuscating opt-outs and these have an even bigger impact on people with visual/processing disabilities.

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#76

Post by angry-hacker »

chrisdone wrote: post #67

Buying tickets with RyanAir is stressful due to these kind of practices. They're less aggressive than in the past, when I wouldn't even continue because I just had zero trust in the company, but they're still sly. A sneaky one I saw recently is something like: [ ] Subscribe to newsletter about our services by unchecking this box. (It doesn't matter whether the box is initially checked or not, the user will be tricked…

Tell me about it.

A few years ago RyanAir's website was much worse. It's actually usable now!

I was somehow able to buy a freaking bag with my ticket. I'm surprised they didn't somehow trick me to buy their lottery too. And I'm tech savvy...

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#77

Post by godelski »

Loic wrote: post #61
prdonahue wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I hate this more than I can express in a public forum. Google is notorious for it, especially when they try to get you to use the YouTube app rather than the web interface. It's not "maybe later" I want—it's "never ask me again".

Google Maps on Android is massively using dark patterns. If you are on the go and open the app, it requests to enable the location service to continue. The choices are: "Enable location service" or "Cancel". It is phrased in a way that it will not run the app if you tap on "Cancel" but it works perfectly if you select "Cancel". The worse, if you agree, it enables the location service for everything all the time where…

And if you have the location service always enabled this gets creepy https://www.google.com/maps/timeline

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#78

Post by angry-hacker »

johansch wrote: post #26

My pet peeve: If you add a credit card to the Uber app there is no way to remove it without replacing it with another valid payment method. If you google solutions to this you get third party recommendations to plead with their customer service to have it removed. Seriously? This customer-hostile approach really needs to be killed.

Is this even legal? I'm in EU and I was able to remove my credit card. Maybe it's an American thing?

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#79

Post by soared »

mtgx wrote: post #39
soared wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree and that goal sounds similar to the goal of Kill Analytics [1]. "The industry" doesn't even exist as an entity. Gov regulation seems like the only viable way to fix it. But on the other hand, Google AdSense has done a lot to improve advertising online. Popups and bad ads used to be waaay worse than they are now (not that they are okay now). So maybe we do just need a few big players to step up and change thin…

For advertising, there is an "industry" that can agree on such things, and it's called the Interactive Advertising Bureau (IAB). In fact, they're now acceptingpublic comments until December 22 on the new ad types that are supposed to be "leaner": https://www.iab.com/newadportfolio/

Thats a good point for advertising. Though iab doesn't touch much for onsite ux outside of display ads. In my limited experience iab perpetuates/supports what most consumers would see as deceitful. Not CRO, but excessive data collection and sharing.

(I'm iab ad ops certified)

Re: Dark Patterns – User Interfaces Designed to Trick People [video]

#80

Post by Nadya »

angry-hacker wrote: post #74

My question is how well these dark patterns work? People who have or must have implemented them, do you have any data? For an example join newsletter pop ups you get on websites. I assume everyone pisses off and closes them, or do they?

I've had the opportunity to speak to quite a few people who use the modal popups for newsletters and the like. They do get used. A lot more than you might imagine - and often enough times to warrant pissing off some small portion of your users.

This may vary on the audience and my anecdata is where N = 5~ devs.

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