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Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

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Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#71
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not going to explain the individual job functions of 50 people, and for folks who work in the industry this should seem like a reasonable number just from their own experience. However, let's do some rough numbers. It says they had 3 product managers. I would guess this means 8-10 engineers. 3 QA folks would be a decent enough ratio. You've then got a GM, a head of product, head of UX, head of data science, head…

> I'm not going to explain the individual job functions of 50 people Good thing I didn't ask you to. > It says they had 3 product managers Seems like a lot of product managers for a company with one product which isn't especially complicated. Smells like a sign of hiring really fast to try to grow. > I would guess this means 8-10 engineers The fuck do they even do? You don't need that many people to make something li…

> If they're managing their own servers that would add a lot of overhead I suppose. If they're just running off EC2 or Linode or whatever then there's not a whole lot of staff there.

The needed headcount in both cases is nearly identical as well as quite significant at Vine's scale and with their type of product, and your assumption otherwise is a pretty clear indicator that you don't have much experience managing an operations team. That's okay, not everyone does, but you should listen to those around you rather than assume you know best in this case.

In operations it gets pretty tiring having engineers explain our role, strategy, and headcount to us, most particularly when this takes the form of criticism such as "you don't need a lot of [or have too many] people to do that," which comes off extraordinarily condescending and diminutive. The one thing that does not exist in all of computing, ever, from Joe's Web Design through Twitter and beyond, is a perfectly-staffed operations team. There is always more work than operators, and always "there are too many of you" sentiment. Always.

Sizing operations is an inexact science but one which yields "too many operators" approximately 0% of the time. When your operators propose dropping GPUs in the fleet to mine cryptocurrency as an additional revenue stream, you might (might) have too many. But not until then.

I'm trying to give you credit here that you mean well but the rest of your comment is somewhat suggesting that I shouldn't, so take it as you will, I suppose.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#72
post #25

It's such a shame, really; arguably Twitter, much more so than their competitors, tries to stick as close to the original form of their product as they can. I admire that. Facebook (and Instagram) and Snapchat have both transformed from their original incarnations, in ways that have improved the companies' valuation, but have not always improved the experience of users. It seems every single social network is trendin…

> Twitter, much more so than their competitors, tries to stick as close to the original form of their product

And I hope they stay that way. Despite reports on twitter's dropping valuation, I find it as an immensely valuable tool for staying up to date. I'd pay to use twitter.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#73

Makes sense, Instagram has essentially beat them at their own game.

Instagram remade vine 100x better

Every time I click a vine video it takes ages to load. I can't remember a similar service with a crappier user experience

The Vine app lasted less than a week on my phone, because it was pretty much unusable. Yes, please, let me play a series of videos with sound while scrolling.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider that two major newsworthy events in the US in the past week (Philando Castillo killing and Dallas attack) were live-streamed on Facebook rather than Periscope. Facebook already has a huge advantage with 10x the active users of Twitter, AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. "App constellations" may be a better…

> AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. > "App constellations" may be a better user experience... if you bother to download the whole constellation... but I think a similar principle to "the best camera is one you have with you" applies. I agree. Why does Facebook insist on Messages being a separate app then? They sho…

Messenger is the new Facebook – there won't be a re-integration, it will more and more replace today's Facebook as we know it.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider that two major newsworthy events in the US in the past week (Philando Castillo killing and Dallas attack) were live-streamed on Facebook rather than Periscope. Facebook already has a huge advantage with 10x the active users of Twitter, AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. "App constellations" may be a better…

> AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. > "App constellations" may be a better user experience... if you bother to download the whole constellation... but I think a similar principle to "the best camera is one you have with you" applies. I agree. Why does Facebook insist on Messages being a separate app then? They sho…

One argument I've heard that makes sense, specifically about uber eats, if the new app is a shit experience and gets one star reviews, it doesn't affect the primary product

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#76
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. > "App constellations" may be a better user experience... if you bother to download the whole constellation... but I think a similar principle to "the best camera is one you have with you" applies. I agree. Why does Facebook insist on Messages being a separate app then? They sho…

Messenger is the new Facebook – there won't be a re-integration, it will more and more replace today's Facebook as we know it.

I don't understand the reasoning behind your conjecture but I don't see that happening because of the different modes of interaction. Messenger is more of a 1-1 channel that focuses on the immediate. Facebook is more of a broadcast channel focusing on passive, asynchronous, entertaining items.

WeChat has been successful with the model that you talk though .... Never say never ...

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#77
The content creators are running for the hills. Almost all of the popular folks I followed no longer post content on a regular basis. It's usually posted as an afterthought. I really enjoyed the comedy section and the time constraints on the video length was great to show off creativity.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#78
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"But there's Twitter. All these years, it has stayed remarkably close to the original concept of microblogging." right, they only added photos, video, FB style profile pages, link shortening, location metadata, algorithmic timeline, moments, messaging, and extensively developed mobile apps but otherwise yes exactly the same as when they were an 140 char SMS broadcast service.

I knew this was going to be challenged, and you're not wrong. But Twitter still feels closest to the original incarnation of 'here be a (roughly) reverse-chronological list of text-message length posts'. They had the timeline, the "friend feed" first, and most enhancements affected only the payload of their messages. Moments was a big innovation, and it's presented as a separate offering on their website. Whereas Fac…

Why are we putting a premium on 'retaining it's original features' ?

This looks like a logical fallacy.

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#79
post #25

It's such a shame, really; arguably Twitter, much more so than their competitors, tries to stick as close to the original form of their product as they can. I admire that. Facebook (and Instagram) and Snapchat have both transformed from their original incarnations, in ways that have improved the companies' valuation, but have not always improved the experience of users. It seems every single social network is trendin…

"But there's Twitter. All these years, it has stayed remarkably close to the original concept of microblogging." right, they only added photos, video, FB style profile pages, link shortening, location metadata, algorithmic timeline, moments, messaging, and extensively developed mobile apps but otherwise yes exactly the same as when they were an 140 char SMS broadcast service.

A lot of that is different from the original, but IMHO not against the "concept of microblogging".

Re: Vine isn’t growing and most of its top executives have left

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AND they integrated live video directly into the app that many of those users already have, rather than a separate app most of them don't. > "App constellations" may be a better user experience... if you bother to download the whole constellation... but I think a similar principle to "the best camera is one you have with you" applies. I agree. Why does Facebook insist on Messages being a separate app then? They sho…

One argument I've heard that makes sense, specifically about uber eats, if the new app is a shit experience and gets one star reviews, it doesn't affect the primary product

That might be valid for most apps or services, but I don't think Facebook needs to worry about their app rating too much. It's almost a required app for most people. Not to mention the rating on the main app took a pretty heavy dive when they separated Messenger out anyway.
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