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Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

gabrielweinberg.com

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Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#71

Post by Goladus »

orblivion wrote: post #67

So the one thing that never seems quite right about this: how/why do we trust that the guy doesn't log IP addresses? Let's put it this way: If someone promises not to do anything bad with the IP addresses they store, and we don't trust them about that , why would we trust someone when they say they don't store them at all?

Flip the question around for a moment. Why aren't we all super paranoid about Google? Because we more or less believe that the way they use the information they collect isn't damaging to us. It doesn't mean we trust them completely, 100%, in every way, shape or form. It doesn't mean we don't use google's service with some degree of reservation that using their service is a bad idea even if they are telling the truth.

If I didn't have a basic level of trust with google I wouldn't use the service. I can apply that same basic level of trust with duckduckgo.

Once you apply that unbiased trust, you have two services: one that uses a variety of technology to protect the information they collect and one that doesn't collect information at all and takes steps to prevent others from doing the same.

Google might get bought out. Google might be subject to a sopoena. A google employee might steal something. Google might make a mistake. Any one of those things might prevent Google from fulfilling the basic promise of "we won't misuse your data." They won't ever have to lie or do anything evil. They might just make a mistake, and all your data will be there, vulnerable.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#72

Post by adrianwaj »

I prefer Google. The full link is in green, it's justified left, the results are wider and don't take as much vertical room. There's a cache too. What does DDG do better than Google? Does DDG have the crawling power of Google or does it pull in Google's results?

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#73

Post by Goladus »

acg wrote: post #68

There's still an issue of trust, why should I trust Duck Duck Go any more than a company that has a reputation to lose? Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

That's a question you have to answer yourself. Right now, Duck Duck Go is the only search service I've ever heard of even trying to make that promise.

As an aside, there are a couple issues with companies and reputation. First is that a company might risk its reputation if the rewards are worth it. Second is that a company might care about its reputation but simply fail to hold true to it. Finally, a company might care about its reputation some of its employees might not.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#74

Post by Goladus »

adrianwaj wrote: post #72

I prefer Google. The full link is in green, it's justified left, the results are wider and don't take as much vertical room. There's a cache too. What does DDG do better than Google? Does DDG have the crawling power of Google or does it pull in Google's results?

What does DDG do better than Google?

SSL connection. Nothing logged. When I don't care about results personalization, and if I get results I am looking for, DDG has the superior service.

Today, if an employee working for Big Evil uses google to do a search for "Software Developer open positions near Cambridge, MA", that search will likely be logged by websense and the internet firewall. That information might be found and used against you by a political enemy (when you work for Big Evil, political enemies emerge from the woodwork).

A search made over an ssl connection won't log the details.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#75

Post by adrianwaj »

Goladus wrote: post #74
adrianwaj wrote: post #72

I prefer Google. The full link is in green, it's justified left, the results are wider and don't take as much vertical room. There's a cache too. What does DDG do better than Google? Does DDG have the crawling power of Google or does it pull in Google's results?

What does DDG do better than Google? SSL connection. Nothing logged. When I don't care about results personalization, and if I get results I am looking for, DDG has the superior service. Today, if an employee working for Big Evil uses google to do a search for "Software Developer open positions near Cambridge, MA", that search will likely be logged by websense and the internet firewall. That information might be foun…

Will the SSL hide a post/get? The SERP still have the terms in the querystring. You can get SSL on other Google apps. Maybe not on search.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#76

Post by paulbaumgart »

adrianwaj wrote: post #75
Goladus wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does DDG do better than Google? SSL connection. Nothing logged. When I don't care about results personalization, and if I get results I am looking for, DDG has the superior service. Today, if an employee working for Big Evil uses google to do a search for "Software Developer open positions near Cambridge, MA", that search will likely be logged by websense and the internet firewall. That information might be foun…

Will the SSL hide a post/get? The SERP still have the terms in the querystring. You can get SSL on other Google apps. Maybe not on search.

Yes, it will hide them. TLS runs at a protocol layer below HTTP: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transport_Layer_Security

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#77

Post by orblivion »

Goladus wrote: post #71
orblivion wrote: post #67

So the one thing that never seems quite right about this: how/why do we trust that the guy doesn't log IP addresses? Let's put it this way: If someone promises not to do anything bad with the IP addresses they store, and we don't trust them about that , why would we trust someone when they say they don't store them at all?

Flip the question around for a moment. Why aren't we all super paranoid about Google? Because we more or less believe that the way they use the information they collect isn't damaging to us. It doesn't mean we trust them completely, 100%, in every way, shape or form. It doesn't mean we don't use google's service with some degree of reservation that using their service is a bad idea even if they are telling the truth.…

Which did happen once with AOL searches. I see your point.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#78

Post by moultano »

epi0Bauqu wrote: post #70
devinj wrote: post #49

It seems sort of like you're destroying the possibility for growth with this, though. From what I understand of Google's work, they really have improved tremendously from analyzing data (to find how searches go wrong), and from using the data in new features (such as with spell checking, adding new terms into the query, personalizing searches, etc.). And I mean, I value privacy. I do. But, I value the quality of the…

There is a lot you can do with the aggregate query data. I do plan to eventually have accounts, i.e. opt-in features. And as for results, I would suggest you try it for a week or so and see for yourself.

The best reason to keep identity in your logs is spam prevention. It may not be a big deal now, but it will be if this works out.

Re: Care about search privacy? Duck Duck Go no longer logs IPs.

#80

Post by shawndrost »

acg wrote: post #68

There's still an issue of trust, why should I trust Duck Duck Go any more than a company that has a reputation to lose? Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

And that's the problem with trying to appeal to paranoid users: they can always find something else to be paranoid about.
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