Enough with the Programming Puzzles • Hacker News Board

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#71

Post by Teeboo » Mon, Jun 06, 2016, 9:05 PM UTC

pandaman wrote: post #68

Teeboo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As as we know, engineers are never in stressful situations so no point testing it. Production never goes down, critical errors don't arise and time-pressure tasks are rare.

People do not behave consistently under stress so such a testing value is close to 0. It's a fight or flight response. If "fight" rolled up on the interview there is no guarantee it will roll up next time your production goes down. You can just as well toss a coin.

...and yet soldiers in WW1 and WW2 were subjected to stressful situations lasting years, some of which manifested in mental trauma but many of which actually behaved in the manner required.

My point is; you are neither psychologist nor professional human resources executive search.

Your reasoning for not conducting testing interviews is flawed and can be challenged at every juncture precisely because this is not your area of expertise.

It's not mine either but I am not advocating sweeping policy changes across an entire professional landscape.

If you feel there is a better route; then write up, test it, get it peer reviewed and implement it.

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#72

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jun 06, 2016, 9:05 PM UTC

pandaman wrote: post #68

Teeboo wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As as we know, engineers are never in stressful situations so no point testing it. Production never goes down, critical errors don't arise and time-pressure tasks are rare.

People do not behave consistently under stress so such a testing value is close to 0. It's a fight or flight response. If "fight" rolled up on the interview there is no guarantee it will roll up next time your production goes down. You can just as well toss a coin.

[deleted]

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#73

Post by pandaman » Mon, Jun 06, 2016, 9:30 PM UTC

Teeboo wrote: post #71

pandaman wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People do not behave consistently under stress so such a testing value is close to 0. It's a fight or flight response. If "fight" rolled up on the interview there is no guarantee it will roll up next time your production goes down. You can just as well toss a coin.

...and yet soldiers in WW1 and WW2 were subjected to stressful situations lasting years, some of which manifested in mental trauma but many of which actually behaved in the manner required. My point is; you are neither psychologist nor professional human resources executive search. Your reasoning for not conducting testing interviews is flawed and can be challenged at every juncture precisely because this is not your…

You can certainly challenge anybody's reasoning just as well as you can challenge anybody in court over any matter. But it requires more than typing first thing that comes into your mind for such a challenge to stick, jfyi.

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#74

Post by Teeboo » Tue, Jun 07, 2016, 6:10 AM UTC

pandaman wrote: post #73

Teeboo wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...and yet soldiers in WW1 and WW2 were subjected to stressful situations lasting years, some of which manifested in mental trauma but many of which actually behaved in the manner required. My point is; you are neither psychologist nor professional human resources executive search. Your reasoning for not conducting testing interviews is flawed and can be challenged at every juncture precisely because this is not your…

You can certainly challenge anybody's reasoning just as well as you can challenge anybody in court over any matter. But it requires more than typing first thing that comes into your mind for such a challenge to stick, jfyi.

But not in this case, the first thing that came to mind was a sufficient rebuttal.

Since you are constantly referencing the legal system you should remember it is the prosecutors role to prove the hypothesis. It is not on the defence to disprove it.

Merely rebutt sufficiently.

You have not made a single compelling argument for not testing coders with the current model.

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#75

Post by wanderer2323 » Tue, Jun 07, 2016, 9:12 AM UTC

pandaman wrote: post #24

wanderer2323 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I.e. they are not playing the anthem of Cambodia on a toy recorder in order to be hired as a death metal band drummer. Think about it this way: they are not playing a full playlist on an actual stage with a soundcheck and live audience either. Compared to the real gig they are performing a smaller task in an artificially simplified environment. It is actually very similar to a coding interview. People often forget t…

People also forget the goal of the hiring process - finding somebody who can get the work done. I am in the game industry and, luckily, not everybody is doing whiteboard coding and puzzles here, but, out of my anecdotal experience, studios that do it also release pretty crappy games. It could be that springboarding discussion is not selecting very good programmers. It could also be that the management who enforces th…

Out of curiosity, what do the studios that don't release crappy games do?

Re: Enough with the Programming Puzzles

#76

Post by pandaman » Tue, Jun 07, 2016, 2:19 PM UTC

wanderer2323 wrote: post #75

pandaman wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People also forget the goal of the hiring process - finding somebody who can get the work done. I am in the game industry and, luckily, not everybody is doing whiteboard coding and puzzles here, but, out of my anecdotal experience, studios that do it also release pretty crappy games. It could be that springboarding discussion is not selecting very good programmers. It could also be that the management who enforces th…

Out of curiosity, what do the studios that don't release crappy games do?

Math and general CS (in the sense of "What is IEEE representation of 1.f?" not "The difference between Red-Black and B- trees?") questions. Past experience questions.