Swifton: Ruby on Rails-inspired web framework for Swift • Hacker News Board

Re: Swifton: Ruby on Rails-inspired web framework for Swift

#71

Post by seivan » Mon, Feb 22, 2016, 12:51 PM UTC

equalarrow wrote: post #57

seivan wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, here https://gist.github.com/seivan/6b6bb19c899dd46f599e I might fork and do my own version where I try to adhere to Swifts strengths while still staying close to Rails API where I can, e.g same naming scheme and pipeline design as Rails. Rails biggest weakness is Ruby. Leveraging Swifts strengths with protocol extension, where clauses and generics could actually improve on Rails current API. Edit[0]: Added an…

Rails biggest weakness is Ruby?!?! The only reason Rails came about (so says DHH) is because of Ruby and its expressiveness as a dynamic language. Granted, we're in Swift mode here and it's static typing, protocols, generics, and closures all the way. I'm fine with this (I write in Swift everyday) but Ruby is a great language as well - I love them both. I think there's a place for both static and dynamic typed langua…

We're both right. Rails look the way it looks because of Ruby. What I am advocating is a compromise between the two of them. Rails-esque packaging, and API design on the entire stack e.g Active Record to Active Support. But using Swift strengths with protocol conformance, extensions, associated-types and etc.

I would never want to work on a larger Ruby code base again. It's just too hard to iterate on as things break too much compared to a larger Swift code base. That's just my take.

I actually like Ruby, but for scripts and smaller code. Not large applications. Same applies for ES6, where I think TypeScript would do a better job.

Re: Swifton: Ruby on Rails-inspired web framework for Swift

#72

Post by _bkgg » Mon, Feb 22, 2016, 1:20 PM UTC

bsaul wrote: post #63

timanglade wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last month, about 60% of our iOS users already used Swift, and the gap in favor of Swift is growing very quickly (it was 50/50 in November 2015). Some of our Swift users you’d probably expect: apps from Vimeo, Digg, Hipmunk or Misfit wearables. But in the past 1-2 months we’ve seen Swift + Realm apps from some real large companies like Cisco, the NFL, NBC Universal, GoDaddy and 7-Eleven. I hope this helps!

I'd love to use realm, but for now i'm still hesitating. One reason is that you're using your own custom storage engine, and building a reliable one is hard. You should release some jespen-like testbench to prove how robust your technology is.

I definitely agree that custom storage engines can be scary! In a way you could say the fact we’re used happily by so many applications on literally hundreds of millions of devices is a test of our reliability, although it’s far from being a formal test of course. We field the overwhelming majority of our issues in public on GitHub and StackOverflow, so you can see the kind of issues we have there. We have a bunch of internal testing on top of that of course, including our own device testing, test suites, and fuzz testing. We’re always up for recommendations on testbench for the kind of storage we do (Jepsen concerns itself only with distributed failure scenarios iirc, which doesn’t apply to us since we’re an embedded/centralized database engine by necessity). I don’t know if this helps or not, but I’m always happy to chat if there’s anything more you’d like to know about

Re: Swifton: Ruby on Rails-inspired web framework for Swift

#73

Post by bsaul » Mon, Feb 22, 2016, 4:05 PM UTC

_bkgg wrote: post #72

bsaul wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to use realm, but for now i'm still hesitating. One reason is that you're using your own custom storage engine, and building a reliable one is hard. You should release some jespen-like testbench to prove how robust your technology is.

I definitely agree that custom storage engines can be scary! In a way you could say the fact we’re used happily by so many applications on literally hundreds of millions of devices is a test of our reliability, although it’s far from being a formal test of course. We field the overwhelming majority of our issues in public on GitHub and StackOverflow, so you can see the kind of issues we have there. We have a bunch of…

One talk that really made me confident in using a new DB technology was this one :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fFDFbi3toc&feature=youtu.be...

Maybe you could make videos and talks about your testing procedures. That would probably help build trust.

nb : you're not distributed, but you're enabling multi-threaded access, in an environment where your app can be killed anytime by the OS. That's quite hostile as well :)

Re: Swifton: Ruby on Rails-inspired web framework for Swift

#74

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Feb 22, 2016, 6:19 PM UTC

bsaul wrote: post #73

_bkgg wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I definitely agree that custom storage engines can be scary! In a way you could say the fact we’re used happily by so many applications on literally hundreds of millions of devices is a test of our reliability, although it’s far from being a formal test of course. We field the overwhelming majority of our issues in public on GitHub and StackOverflow, so you can see the kind of issues we have there. We have a bunch of…

One talk that really made me confident in using a new DB technology was this one : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fFDFbi3toc&feature=youtu.be... Maybe you could make videos and talks about your testing procedures. That would probably help build trust. nb : you're not distributed, but you're enabling multi-threaded access, in an environment where your app can be killed anytime by the OS. That's quite hostile as well…

[deleted]