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Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

developers.meethue.com

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Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#71

Post by jads »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #36
culturestate wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this would accomplish anything vis-a-vis brand protection, since consumers have been conditioned to just click "OK" at every dialog box that doesn't look like it will explode a mine. Six months down the line, nobody would remember the warning -- they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks.

> they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks. Would they? Wouldn't they blame their bulb first? It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. Most people would blame the program and look for another one. I'm sure there are some who have it backwards, and they probably will be calling support, but I can't imagine there's enough of them for a company to ac…

I've worked in tech support for many years, and the vast majority of people would blame the PC manufacturer or the operating system for the problems. I spent many years on the Genius Bar (back in the PowerPC and early Intel days) and, in almost, every interaction, the device was to blame - as far as the customer was concerned. In some cases, they were right, in others it was due to outdated software, buggy third-party drivers or just something they bought that was not Mac compatible. But as far as the customer was concerned, it didn't work so therefore it was a problem with their computer.

What has to be remembered is that the types of people who read Hacker News would understand, in more detail, what might be causing the issue and know troubleshooting is all part of the process. I bet printer companies get many calls a day from people who bought third-party cartridges (sometimes without realising) and complaining that their stupid printer isn't working and that it must be the printer's fault.

The vast majority of consumers who would walk into an Apple Store or Best Buy to purchase something like this, they just think of it as one big ecosystem. If it doesn't work with a bulb they bought off the internet, they will simply assume the product, as a whole, is terrible.

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#72

Post by TeMPOraL »

golergka wrote: post #54
TeMPOraL wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks. Would they? Wouldn't they blame their bulb first? It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. Most people would blame the program and look for another one. I'm sure there are some who have it backwards, and they probably will be calling support, but I can't imagine there's enough of them for a company to ac…

> It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. Most people would blame the program and look for another one. Have you met "most people"? They would blame PC manufacturer indeed. Just remember Vista and how suddenly all kinds of software stopped working. Surprise: most of the time, this software used undocumented features and sometimes even bugs present in previous Windows…

I did. I spent a lot of time fixing "computer stuff" for those people.

I remember Vista (ironically, I'm probably the only person I know who didn't have a problem with it and, besides the slow file copying, geneally liked it) - but there, in a way, some blame towards MS was justified. They were releasing a next iteration of their operating system to the already mature software market that's built on interoperability. Microsoft itself had a strong tradition of caring about backward compatibility. With Vista, they failed to provide an OS compatibile with existing application ecosystem, even if it's third party developers who didn't follow the specs.

Here, on the other hand, the "bulb" ecosystem is only starting, and Hue is the reference platform.

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#73

Post by TeMPOraL »

pjc50 wrote: post #42
TeMPOraL wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A LED bulb converts your 230V AC (or 110V in the US) power source into 12V DC (in case of Hue itself). This converter part can, if poorly made, create a fire hazard. And a bulb is usually mounted inside a lamp, many of which are flammable and have the shape that will accumulate heat inside instead of dissipating it.

.. but that's not a software issue.

I know, but 'raverbashing wasn't talking about one. He asked how a LED lamp could burn your house down.

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#74

Post by TeMPOraL »

raverbashing wrote: post #60
TeMPOraL wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A LED bulb converts your 230V AC (or 110V in the US) power source into 12V DC (in case of Hue itself). This converter part can, if poorly made, create a fire hazard. And a bulb is usually mounted inside a lamp, many of which are flammable and have the shape that will accumulate heat inside instead of dissipating it.

Yes, but that applies to china mobile chargers and a lot of other devices that nobody worries about (and also to CFDs and any led lamp that might be today in your house) And of course it's not a software issue

> And of course it's not a software issue

Of course it's not. You weren't talking about one, you asked how a LED lamp can burn your house down. It can.

Personally, I can't see how someone could legitimately blame Philips for a Hue-connected-but-unsupported third-party bulb starting a fire, but I don't doubt some will try.

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#75

Post by CodeCube »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #59
dtech wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Windows crashes because of an badly coded third-party driver, do you think people will blame Windows or the driver manufacturer? Most people will not internalize the workings of the system and just blame the system as a whole, which in this case has the brand name Philips on it. I think it's a smart move and reasonable compromise, similar to Microsofts WHQL program.

Badly coded driver is a special case, because it often crashes the system in a way seemingly unrelated to the installation itself (or software it came with), showing you a nasty blue screen (which is known generally as "the Windows problem"). I know most people get confused about cases like these (and had more than enough experience with fixing them for such people). But I used a different analogy on purpose. You bou…

> I find it hard to believe there are many people who can't connect the dots.

lol, bro ... have you worked with humans like, ever?

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#76

Post by dTal »

pc86 wrote: post #57
TeMPOraL wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks. Would they? Wouldn't they blame their bulb first? It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. Most people would blame the program and look for another one. I'm sure there are some who have it backwards, and they probably will be calling support, but I can't imagine there's enough of them for a company to ac…

> It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. If I had a dime for every time I heard someone say "This _____ing computer!" every time a program crashed...

Reminds me of the joke:

"If Bill Gates had a nickel for every time Windows crashed... wait a second, he does!"

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#77

Post by brudgers »

arbitrage wrote: post #58
brudgers wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The useful solution from a customer [1] standpoint is to create value at the level of the interface by just making it work with whatever is hooked up...e.g. decoupling the service from other services. Imagine if Google search only worked for Android device owners. Making each part of a system excellent in it's own right is just better...here it would drive the bulb making team to make bulbs capable of frolicking outs…

Google services routinely work better via Chrome. So, I think we can imagine it. Turns out people don't care that much.

Excellent example! Customers figure out what works for them as individuals all on their own. Chrome works best for one person due to superior integration with Google's services. Another person trades that integration for the convenience of Firemacs. A third person finds the identity management of the Chromium Browser advantageous.

And all can search with Google!

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#78

Post by HelloNurse »

revelation wrote: post #66

Not sure why people are screaming "boycott". Philips never advertised their system as being compatible with third-party lights. The fact that they use an open protocol to communicate with their own lights doesn't change this. It's like connecting to your office chat with an IRC client because you figured out that's what they are using under the hood. Why would you scream bloody murder when one day your IRC client sto…

Not bothering to test and actively support devices from other vendors would be reasonable, but customers have the expectation that a product does a decent effort to respect the standard; whitelisting a subset of Philips lightbulbs and deliberately refusing to work with anything else means giving users a bad product for the sake of anticompetitive business practices. This kind of deliberate, obviously harmful abuse is worse than merely reckless behaviour like the Superfish scandal or the Windows 10 update that uninstalls user software.

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#79

Post by Agathos »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #36
culturestate wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this would accomplish anything vis-a-vis brand protection, since consumers have been conditioned to just click "OK" at every dialog box that doesn't look like it will explode a mine. Six months down the line, nobody would remember the warning -- they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks.

> they'd still get mad at Philips when a third-party bulb breaks. Would they? Wouldn't they blame their bulb first? It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work. Most people would blame the program and look for another one. I'm sure there are some who have it backwards, and they probably will be calling support, but I can't imagine there's enough of them for a company to ac…

>Would they?

Yes.

>Wouldn't they blame their bulb first?

No.

>It's like complaining to your PC manufacturer that a program you downloaded doesn't work.

Yes, and people do that all the time.

>Most people would blame the program and look for another one.

Bro, do you even tech support?

Re: Philips reverses decision to close the Hue Platform

#80

Post by JoBrad »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #59
dtech wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Windows crashes because of an badly coded third-party driver, do you think people will blame Windows or the driver manufacturer? Most people will not internalize the workings of the system and just blame the system as a whole, which in this case has the brand name Philips on it. I think it's a smart move and reasonable compromise, similar to Microsofts WHQL program.

Badly coded driver is a special case, because it often crashes the system in a way seemingly unrelated to the installation itself (or software it came with), showing you a nasty blue screen (which is known generally as "the Windows problem"). I know most people get confused about cases like these (and had more than enough experience with fixing them for such people). But I used a different analogy on purpose. You bou…

Have you seen any Linux forum/fan ever, who talks about Windows and BSOD?
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