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Ways to start eating insects

smithsonianmag.com

71–80 of 128 posts

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#71
post #44
post #3

So why should we eat insects? The standard answer is: it is a cheap and sustainable source of protein. But I have yet to see a convincing argument that it is cheaper and more sustainable than soy protein, aka tofu.

> But I have yet to see a convincing argument that it is cheaper and more sustainable than soy protein, aka tofu. This, and I'd like to see a convincing argument that it's actually delicious to eat. Eating is not just about surviving, it should be a pleasure as well, and I think you need to overcome a lot of barriers before you can actually put an insect in your mouth, no matter how "good" it's supposed to be for you…

In Some regions of Mexico people eat a certain type of grasshoper. No worse than eating shrimp or lobster (which is just a really ugly large insect).

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#72
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's just one thing I don't get... Too much carbohydrates are supposed to be bad. Too much soy is supposed to be bad. But the Japanese live the longest, so obviously they can't be that bad. So one of these assumptions must be false: - Japanese eat a lot of rice and/or soy (or products made from them) - Japanese have different genetics that allows them to avoid the negative effects of carbs/soy. We could probably t…

Actually the Japanese and also many Chinese are running into problems with health because of high salt and such. Soy not as much, and I don't really believe the breast cancer stuff or east asian countries would be the no.1 place for those kinds of cancers.

You think it's salt and not increasing obesity rates?

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#73
post #6
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I asked myself the same question. Why do we need to replace meat by something? Are vegans really lacking protein? Moreover, even if it's true, if we just take into account an important diminution of the meat consumption, will people lack proteins? I'm assuming we eat more meat than we ever did in our history.

The comment you replied to talked about cheap and sustainable sources of protein. Meat is neither.

Why isn't meat a sustainable source of protein?

And yes, I'm pretty much aware of current industrial farming processes and what that does to the environment, but maybe you're missing the forest from the trees, as in maybe it's industrial farming that we should get rid of. Plants and animals are basically engines storing and converting the sun's energy into nutrients and natural ecosystems are very much sustainable. Add fossil fuels in the equation, like what the industrial age did and you get the current clusterfuck. Our grandparents seemed to have no problem in raising their own livestock with sustainable practices. Surely we can do better than them, since we live in the information age and all that.

And for people worried about efficiency, cost and over-population, we are wasting about one third of the food we produce right now. And we spend much less of our income and time on acquiring food. There is room for taking a step back in terms of throughput and maybe focus on quality rather than quantity. Which might be a good idea given that even though the calories in our food is at an all times high, for the first time in history we're seeing overweight children suffering from malnutrition.

The real problem I'm having with your argument, as it's what vegans usually say, is that if you want cheap, you can't beat a combination of corn and soy grown through an industrial process, as these are the most efficient farmed plants we have. Whereas many fruits are very inefficient, consume a lot of water and are not sustainable at scale. Just saying, if you want efficiency, start eating corn.

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#74
post #63
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because it's not a myth that high protein diets are healthful. High protein diets typically result in better maintenance of lean mass (muscle) and better health markers if compared with one that replaces protein with carbs ( http://examine.com/faq/how-does-protein-affect-weight-loss/ ) Many studies have shown that replacing fat or carbs 1:1 (by calories) with protein leads to better body composition and (som…

Please check the citations carefully. The very first one I opened said, > Funding sources: Illinois Council on Food and Agricultural Research, National Cattlemen’s Beef Association, The Beef Board, Kraft Foods, National Science Foundation (PI: Layman). Dr Layman has participated in speaker bureaus for the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association and the National Dairy Council. Another reported, > Supported by a Medical…

Conflicts of interest are almost always present with something as fiercely debated as nutrition. On the low-protein side, much of the research is performed or reported by biased organizations like Center for Science in the Public Interest. Even if a moral case can be made for not eating animals, it shouldn't be allowed to influence nutritional science.

Attacking conflicts of interest is an easy out (ad hominem); do you have some actual citations refuting the science in some of those references?

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#75
post #68

I've eaten chapulines (grasshoppers). Their taste reminded me of what I think slightly toasted grass might taste like. I didn't care for them, but would try them again if someone who liked them recommended a different preparation and I wouldn't hesitate to eat them if I needed protein.

I find it weird that people do that with language. Did you also drink agua, breathe aire, walk on calles, or sleep on camas? Why is it we only do this for some things but not others?

Nothing wrong with that. Is rare enough that I think the name chapulin is OK. It says a lot. It means he is probably talking about a region of Mexico and that he is maybe from Mexico. It is an actual thing in Mexico to eat a certain type of grasshoper. There is another type of insect called a xumile that is eaten. No idea how you would call that in English. I'm not even sure if I havr the spelling right in Spanish.

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#76
post #47
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know, just seems to be the general vibe from many of the recent 'eating insects' stories: raising insects is more sustainable than regular meet because it consumes less meat and land, and emits less greenhouse gasses.

Not sure if you could produce enough insects for the whole wide world or even a country. For animal products, its been demonstrated at large scale. For insects, it has never been done so I'd like to see how it scales, and what kind of problems come from scaling up. Until then, it's just a nice fantasy.

Well, ants and termites together are estimated to have about as much biomass as all cattle, sheep, and goats combined... [1]

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biomass_%28ecology%29#Global_b...

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#77
post #26
post #22

Mechanisms for sustainability and productivity - the Haber-Bosch process, genetic engineering, the "green revolution", etc. - are a bit of a two-edge sword in that they have allowed for massive population growth. New highways ultimately increase traffic through induced demand. Is not a similar effect at play with these technologies? I don't want to have to start eating bugs just to make room for a few billion more fe…

What a cynical, inhuman, and shortsighted comment. The right way to stop population growth is not to starve poor countries to death, but to bring them to a higher level of wealth, education, and stability. Do this, and overpopulation (and a bunch of other problems) will solve itself.

I think you've wildly misinterpreted my point. Perhaps it's my fault for how I phrased things. I think these technologies, while undoubtably beneficial, have for many decades only pushed back the Malthusian limits imposed by nature which allowed exponential population growth while just as many people remained hungry and destitute.

We're finally turning the corner where the population growth rate has slowed somewhat (recent UN population projections where increased significantly; e.g. Sub-Saharan Africa alone is projected to have a population of 4.5 billion(!) by 2100) allowing people to get ahead of the rate of increased food production. But we're still basically just using up most of the increased production.

Vaclav Smil has pointed out that population growth has been directly corollated to the amount of artificial fertilizers. He points out that even if every bit of arable land was used to its maximum extent, only 3 billion people could be supported. So just think, by 2100 when the UN projects a population of 11 billion, 8 billion of those people will only be alive because the proteins in their bodies use nitrogen from factories producing artificial fertilizers.

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#78
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I asked myself the same question. Why do we need to replace meat by something? Are vegans really lacking protein? Moreover, even if it's true, if we just take into account an important diminution of the meat consumption, will people lack proteins? I'm assuming we eat more meat than we ever did in our history.

Right, vegans are not protein deficient and many people thrive on high carb diets (see blue zones, adventist health studies, etc.) Unfortunately we've all been bombarded with the protein myth (more protein == healthier) and even the smart people of HN can't seem to question this belief objectively.

It's still important to get complete protein in your diet (which isn't that hard, and there are some plant sources of complete protein, like quinoa). Not to mention that it appear that high-protein diets (especially from animal sources) lead to a variety of health risks[1].

1: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1550413114...

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#79
We eat birds and animals because they have high efficiency skeletons and circulation systems so they grow to large sizes and so their muscles become larger. Insects have exoskeletons and the spiracle based (air pipes throughout their flesh) respiratory system places limits on their sizes. If grasshoppers grew to be as big as cows, I am sure they would provide harvestable muscle masses to eat. As it is, the work of harvesting 10,000 grashopper legs and extractin their muscles, just ruins the economics of it.

Same with grubs, although the Australian witchetty grub. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witchetty_grub https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNsCpRZXq68

is comparable to small shrimps as a edible lump. I am not sure if they need deveining, like shrimps where the lower intestine is removed from the tail to leave the entire peeled tail as high quality fat and protein. A 200 pound witchetty grub might offer witchetty steaks etc. If we selectively bred insects in high oxygen environment to grow them to large sizes, we might change the ease of harvesting grasshopper steaks etc - but that is for ~~100 years in the future

Re: Ways to start eating insects

#80
post #22

Mechanisms for sustainability and productivity - the Haber-Bosch process, genetic engineering, the "green revolution", etc. - are a bit of a two-edge sword in that they have allowed for massive population growth. New highways ultimately increase traffic through induced demand. Is not a similar effect at play with these technologies? I don't want to have to start eating bugs just to make room for a few billion more fe…

The average number of children per women worldwide is only 2.40, which is not that much above replacement and has been falling for decades. Primarily because the child mortality rate has fallen (drastically so) along with the number of very poor people. Richer people can expect to see all their children reach adulthood, and so they want to have a lot less.

http://kff.org/global-indicator/total-fertility-rate/

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