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Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

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Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#71

Post by pera »

wfo wrote: post #53
mattress wrote: post #9

Took a job in Bellevue in April and moved from Philadelphia to Seattle. So far it's a been an interesting experience. I've encountered many people hostile to software engineers in general. A bunch of people immediately ask if I work for Amazon with a hint of disdain after I state my occupation. So it hasn't felt super welcoming so far. I get it, even in some neighborhoods in Philadelphia the same thing is happening.…

Seattle has never been particularly welcoming to newcomers; people there tend to be insular and it can be hard to make friends if you don't already know people (even before the amazon/tech stuff -- plenty of articles about 'the seattle freeze' that predate it). Being from there helps. Not being in tech helps -- there are so many new software engineers meeting one just isn't very interesting. You can hardly blame peop…

I keep reading all these scary stories about how unwelcoming people from Seattle is; I moved here back in February and my experience until now have been completely the opposite: almost every Seattleite I meet is super friendly and talkative, at the point that it feels almost like being in a small town.

Maybe I am just lucky? but I think Seattle is one of the coolest cities in the US, except of course for the traffic.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#72

Post by peatmoss »

13thLetter wrote: post #50
peatmoss wrote: post #14

I've only lived in Seattle for about 6 years, but have seen / felt a rise in rents over that time. When we moved here, lots of rentals were offering one or two months free rent as a move in special. Now, not so much. Because he was sick of friends moving away, a friend of mine made his rookie run for the city council this past year. He didn't survive the primary, but he had some good ideas about housing that have in…

> Here the idea is that Seattle would run its own voucher program to subsidize rents for low-income people. The problem with subsidy programs like that is that the rents then simply go up by the amount of the subsidy.

You're right that subsidy tends to increase prices, but the rate by which that happens isn't fixed the way you describe. Vouchers result in an average increase in buying power. Over the whole population of renters (those eligible and those ineligible), this would be a marginal increase. And yes, it's likely rents would achieve a new equilibrium consistent with that aggregate increase in buying power.

But, on the other hand, the voucher programs would increase the buying power of the absolute neediest people at a greater marginal rate than for the population as a whole. The end result is that poor people's ability to participate in the housing market still improves, in that their ability to meet rent becomes more commensurate with people more affluent than them.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#73

Post by [deleted] »

zardo wrote: post #66
ulysses wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2015 estimate: 662,400 2010 estimate: 608,658 Assuming every one of those 53,742 people was male, the ratio would go from 50% female to 45.9% female.

It if I can't blame my dating troubles on demographics I might have to consider that I am less desirable a mate than I like to imagine.

[deleted]

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#74

Post by s73v3r »

pm90 wrote: post #12

> John Criscitello placed posters in Seattle's Capitol Hill neighborhood proclaiming “Welcome! Rich Kids,” and “Wish you weren’t here.” Its hard not to feel angry at people like this. "Rich Kids" really? These "Kids" spent years developing their engineering skills to get to the point where they are now. Are engineers paid a lot? Of course. But we're certainly not in the same category as those who inherit wealth. Most…

At the same time, they're people that are coming in and pushing people who have lived there out, simply because they have more money. That would piss most people off.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#75

Post by nicpottier »

txru wrote: post #26
nicpottier wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Capitol Hill is the most glaring change to me in the past 5 years. One of the neatest and most unique neighborhoods in the city, in a way iconic to how Seattle was seen is now filled with brand new condos and multi-use buildings. For god sakes there have been gay-hate crimes on Broadway. Yes, tons of new development has happened in SLU, but that area wasn't much of an established neighborhood to live in befor…

It seems to me that the fact that Capitol Hill was the unique, Bohemian, and affordable neighborhood that it was in your memories was just an accident of the 20th century. It's: * Right next to downtown * Has great views and * Has very easy access to a major road, I-5. Why on earth wouldn't having credentials like that make it prime property, even if a certain retailer didn't exist? But from 1950 - 1990, nobody wante…

I don't actually disagree that it is a wonder Capitol Hill was unchanged for so long, but that doesn't mean we can't bemoan the fact that that era has largely ended.

I know that in general this is a trite topic and your quote about "no more development" is a valid one, but so is the opposite.

There's another funny quote, apparently from Yogi Berra, which is roughly: "Oh that restaurant, nobody goes there anymore, it is too crowded." And I think that kind of touches on the same thing.

Some people picked Seattle / Capitol Hill for the characteristics it had (apart from proximity to downtown), and it is only natural for us to bemoan that it isn't that anymore. Maybe that is just a fundamental truth, that with growth you will lose some "flavor", but perhaps it is also worth trying to see if city planning can help a city grow so that it doesn't.

That's the point. Of course things change, but maybe appropriate planning and policies can make it so that we don't lose what was so great about these neighborhoods in the first place.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#76

Post by hockeybias »

pera wrote: post #71
wfo wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seattle has never been particularly welcoming to newcomers; people there tend to be insular and it can be hard to make friends if you don't already know people (even before the amazon/tech stuff -- plenty of articles about 'the seattle freeze' that predate it). Being from there helps. Not being in tech helps -- there are so many new software engineers meeting one just isn't very interesting. You can hardly blame peop…

I keep reading all these scary stories about how unwelcoming people from Seattle is; I moved here back in February and my experience until now have been completely the opposite: almost every Seattleite I meet is super friendly and talkative, at the point that it feels almost like being in a small town. Maybe I am just lucky? but I think Seattle is one of the coolest cities in the US, except of course for the traffic.

The traffic. Ugh. ...I remember, even twenty years ago, having to slog along under 40 mph from SeaTac to Seattle on a Saturday - early in the afternoon.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#77

Post by roymurdock »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #31
peatmoss wrote: post #14

I've only lived in Seattle for about 6 years, but have seen / felt a rise in rents over that time. When we moved here, lots of rentals were offering one or two months free rent as a move in special. Now, not so much. Because he was sick of friends moving away, a friend of mine made his rookie run for the city council this past year. He didn't survive the primary, but he had some good ideas about housing that have in…

This is a severely under-appreciated point about housing costs. I live in a college town and rents have been climbing to the degree where the ratio of income to housing expenses is the highest in the nation, leaving New York and San Francisco in the dust. Every once in a while there will be more proposals to build condos over existing houses or apartments. We've been here before: housing stock is considerably increas…

Minor point, but I think you mean inelastic goods.

The only solution I can see to solve my rent problem is to move to a very low-demand market. Looking into hunkering down in a cabin in Alaksa for a while because rents in the Boston area are just dumb for a recent grad.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#78

Post by bndw »

seathrowa wrote: post #28
nicpottier wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Capitol Hill is the most glaring change to me in the past 5 years. One of the neatest and most unique neighborhoods in the city, in a way iconic to how Seattle was seen is now filled with brand new condos and multi-use buildings. For god sakes there have been gay-hate crimes on Broadway. Yes, tons of new development has happened in SLU, but that area wasn't much of an established neighborhood to live in befor…

For those unfamiliar with Seattle, SLU is adjacent to Capitol Hill. So, some Amazon employees inevitably live in Cap Hill, which is for some reason a desirable place to live (lots of night life activities, crappy transit options). Cap Hill used to be a gay / artist / low income district of Seattle but is increasingly wealthy tech workers. I don't see this as a bad thing but obviously some people do.

Cap Hill used to be a gay / artist / low income district of Seattle but is increasingly wealthy tech workers. I don't see this as a bad thing but obviously some people do.

I think this comparison misses the point. The think the main complain with the change is just that, change. Capitol Hill used to feel much more eclectic and diverse. Today, personally, I don't feel that sentiment.

FWIW, I've lived in the neighborhood for ~7 years.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#79

Post by ergothus »

mattress wrote: post #9

Took a job in Bellevue in April and moved from Philadelphia to Seattle. So far it's a been an interesting experience. I've encountered many people hostile to software engineers in general. A bunch of people immediately ask if I work for Amazon with a hint of disdain after I state my occupation. So it hasn't felt super welcoming so far. I get it, even in some neighborhoods in Philadelphia the same thing is happening.…

Interesting - I moved from VA (Originally from PA) to Seattle a bit over 3 years ago, and my experience has been pretty different. However, I work downtown and live on Shoreline, which is quite different from Bellevue.

I've found Seattle quite friendly to newcomers (Some friends visited and it took 3 days before some stranger didn't cover their drinks when out for dinner), and open and welcoming to me on multiple levels (as a tech person, as a board and RPG gamer, and as a geek in general, not to mention as someone far more socially liberal than Virginia was kind to).

That said, I've learned there are a ton of neighborhoods here, each with their own flavor and style, and I've only "known" a few of them. Woodinville is not Freemont is not Bothell is not Bellevue.

Re: Seattle, in Midst of Tech Boom, Tries to Keep Its Soul

#80

Post by s73v3r »

joesmo wrote: post #23
pm90 wrote: post #12

> John Criscitello placed posters in Seattle's Capitol Hill neighborhood proclaiming “Welcome! Rich Kids,” and “Wish you weren’t here.” Its hard not to feel angry at people like this. "Rich Kids" really? These "Kids" spent years developing their engineering skills to get to the point where they are now. Are engineers paid a lot? Of course. But we're certainly not in the same category as those who inherit wealth. Most…

It's also ridiculous that these same people benefit greatly from a growing economy that's directly influenced by (and these days also partially propped up by) the boom in tech while deriding it like it's some kind of negative force. It sounds to me a lot more like envy than any nostalgia for artistry and run-down neighborhoods, as they claim.

Money isn't everything to a lot of people. On top of that, how much do they benefit if they end up chased out of their neighborhood?
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