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Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

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Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#71

Post by mattkrea »

I understand this is far from the point of this piece but interesting bit anyway I think.. I don't agree with some of what she says (I've gone through this account recovery process without issue since it's been in place for quite a while--I deleted my account 2 or 3 years ago).

Twitter I expect to be a place where I am following strangers. Facebook on the other hand.. I am very much surprised to see that she could not identify people that she has 'friended' (the 'all black people look alike' Facebook bug aside). Why click 'friend' if you don't actually know the person?

Again, I understand that is not the whole point of the article but it is worth mentioning that Facebook has been pulling this stuff for years and for her to get ticked off about this stuff now seems a bit ridiculous.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#72

Post by techdragon »

morganvachon wrote: post #62
hugh4 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried reading the entire article, I really did. But it kept jumping around and losing focus from one thing to another that she was upset about. Eventually I figured out the answer to the question I came here for. It turns out that the reason the author is sitting at home crying on a Saturday night is because he/she/it is an emotionally unstable wreck who can't deal with life's minor inconveniences and enjoys creati…

Facebook's mistreatment of LGBT folks is a real, documented thing that has existed for many years, and one of their pain points for that group is forcing a person to provide government ID and a "real name", which can then be used to ban the account for "misrepresenting" their sexual orientation as well as expose them to harassment from hate groups. The author is an outspoken advocate for LGBT rights, so I can see whe…

What's hilarious to me is this is one of the times, linguistically speaking, where you have an "easy out". The author could have used "they" without it being insulting since it's valid mostly normal English.

I'm not a otherwise biased person here. I seriously can't understand why anyone feels the need to make make life harder for someone over a petty thing.

Except when language matters. I often feel something I've started calling "pronoun paralysis" and it's not because I'm talking to someone that doesn't care about this and I'm attempting to "inject" bias into the conversation by awkwardly referring to a male to female post op female who identifies as female as anything other than "she". It's the opposite, when I want to talk in detail with someone about this topic who does care, or who is a member of the LGBT community, it's time to put on the linguistic bomb disposal suit and waddle my way awkwardly through a conversation like I'm recreating a scene from The Hurt Locker. Can we all just be more accepting of the use of they/them/theirs and end this mess? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singular_they

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#73

Post by techdragon »

jtoll wrote: post #70

Whether you sympathize with her plight or think she's ridiculous, one important issue remains for all Facebook users. Even if you quit using Facebook, there's no assurance that Facebook will stop collecting data on you, and there's no assurance that Facebook will purge data pertaining to you from their database and website. In fact, it appears that your absence does nothing to curtail their data collection, nor their…

Having a profile you can "claim" is a feature, just look at IMDB actor profiles if you want a more understandable example that's not reliant on Facebook's creepy surveillance. It's not creepy to Facebook that they gather the info ergo they see no reason to not create the absentee profile since to them the profile is "look we've already done all this work for you" type bait for the few remaining internet users not on Facebook.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#74

Post by MichaelGG »

wanorris wrote: post #49
MichaelGG wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That link is strange. Person is using Facebook. They then voluntarily send Facebook their birth certificate and are bewildered and upset that Facebook used that info and corrected (read: edited) their profile? I really dislike Facebook but come on, you signed up for this. If you don't like Facebook's policies (and you shouldn't), then don't use it. What gives anyone the right to use someone else's service, then dicta…

The birth certificate was not the only form of ID that person sent. Facebook outed the past name of a transgender person -- that's never ok, and it's a problem taken very seriously in the transgender community. And yes, if you want, you could say that, well, trans people just shouldn't use Facebook, but given the position Facebook occupies in our society in practice, that's quite a statement. Just as important, in ca…

No, my attitude isn't anything about trans people.

Facebook is a bad force in society. It's known how anti privacy they are. So you choose to deal with them at your own risk.

I certainly would love for Facebook to be slapped down, somehow: I only desire bad things for that company. They should certainly be forced to change their policies and I enjoy seeing any pressure on them for that reason. And perhaps one day there can be a law somehow, though it probably makes more sense to allow people get to get a birth certificate with their new name as that'd be more general.

Meanwhile, if your ID docs contain such info, then perhaps maybe don't share them, maybe? Or just Photoshop your birth cert? I don't know anyone that'd give up their ID to Facebook in the first place, let alone if it was high-risk.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#75

Post by MichaelGG »

hugh4 wrote: post #53
wanorris wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The birth certificate was not the only form of ID that person sent. Facebook outed the past name of a transgender person -- that's never ok, and it's a problem taken very seriously in the transgender community. And yes, if you want, you could say that, well, trans people just shouldn't use Facebook, but given the position Facebook occupies in our society in practice, that's quite a statement. Just as important, in ca…

> Facebook outed the past name of a transgender person -- that's never ok, and it's a problem taken very seriously in the transgender community. Why is that not okay? I mean, if people want to change their names for whatever reason then that's fine, but that doesn't mean that everybody is obliged to pretend that your old name never existed. If I were Hitler, living under an assumed name in Argentina, and somebody out…

It's overstepping Facebook's bounds. While legal, it's rather rude and just shows what a shitty service they are: don't trust them with your info.

At best, it's a mismatch between what Facebook thinks it is and what users are led to believe.

Though, in practise, it's doubtful that it's actually company policy to do this. It's most likely the result of crappy support departments, overloaded with tons of requests. (Users are mostly idiots, so most tickets are of poor quality, and it leads to being aggressive in "resolving" tickets, even when the user is fine and in the right.)

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#76

Post by PhantomGremlin »

mattkrea wrote: post #71

I understand this is far from the point of this piece but interesting bit anyway I think.. I don't agree with some of what she says (I've gone through this account recovery process without issue since it's been in place for quite a while--I deleted my account 2 or 3 years ago). Twitter I expect to be a place where I am following strangers. Facebook on the other hand.. I am very much surprised to see that she could no…

Why click 'friend' if you don't actually know the person?

Perhaps someone is a relative in another country? Someone who you've never seen in person, or maybe you met for a few minutes, 30 years ago.

That's the situation with me. I created a Facebook account years ago but never used it. I recently logged in again to contact a particular individual. I had 13 friend requests pending. Which I accepted, even though I didn't "know" the people.

Those people were my cousins in another country, and their spouses, and their children, etc. Other members of my extended family interact with them, even though I don't.

So should I refuse their friend requests? No. Facebook is for more than friends that you can identify. It's a way to keep in (loose?) contact with distant relatives.

I'm sure there are plenty of other reasons why people "friend" people they don't "actually know". The real world isn't as simple as you suggest.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#77

Post by MichaelGG »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #45
MichaelGG wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That link is strange. Person is using Facebook. They then voluntarily send Facebook their birth certificate and are bewildered and upset that Facebook used that info and corrected (read: edited) their profile? I really dislike Facebook but come on, you signed up for this. If you don't like Facebook's policies (and you shouldn't), then don't use it. What gives anyone the right to use someone else's service, then dicta…

> corrected their profile You're either unintentionally or deliberately making the extremely offensive implication that Facebook knows better than their user about what identity they want to show to the world. Facebook has no business "correcting" any field of a user's profile based on a birth certificate. They have no business asking for a birth certificate. And they wonder why people refuse to send them "government…

I didn't mean to imply that and I've changed my comment to reflect edited.

I agree with you. Facebook should fuck off. Yet this is ultimately a big part of their platform, collecting data on users. This isn't much of a secret.

If your ID puts lives at risk, why send the original version to a third party with a reputation for being against privacy? If for whatever reason you decide you must deal with them, at least submit fake docs.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#78

Post by MichaelGG »

hugh4 wrote: post #32
morganvachon wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And then jumped through every possible hoop in order to keep using their website! I don't think you read the entire article. Her goal at this point is to delete her account[1], which she cannot do until she regains control of the account. She's at a stalemate right now. [1] "But now I just want out. I want my account deleted. I want the bullshit, inaccurate pages Facebook creates about me without my consent gone, t…

I tried reading the entire article, I really did. But it kept jumping around and losing focus from one thing to another that she was upset about. Eventually I figured out the answer to the question I came here for. It turns out that the reason the author is sitting at home crying on a Saturday night is because he/she/it is an emotionally unstable wreck who can't deal with life's minor inconveniences and enjoys creati…

I agree the article isn't great, but I downvoted and flagged for the "it" slur. There's no need to talk like this. And the FB issue really goes far beyond trans or lbtq or any such personal characteristic. The privacy concerns run deep and should be troubling to everyone.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#79

Post by jtoll »

techdragon wrote: post #73
jtoll wrote: post #70

Whether you sympathize with her plight or think she's ridiculous, one important issue remains for all Facebook users. Even if you quit using Facebook, there's no assurance that Facebook will stop collecting data on you, and there's no assurance that Facebook will purge data pertaining to you from their database and website. In fact, it appears that your absence does nothing to curtail their data collection, nor their…

Having a profile you can "claim" is a feature, just look at IMDB actor profiles if you want a more understandable example that's not reliant on Facebook's creepy surveillance. It's not creepy to Facebook that they gather the info ergo they see no reason to not create the absentee profile since to them the profile is "look we've already done all this work for you" type bait for the few remaining internet users not on…

The entirety of your assertion is specious, but there's little value in debating it. The simple fact is that when a user closes their account, they should, at a minimum, be offered the ability to hide their profile from display. Ideally, they would be offered the ability to delete the entirety of their profile data. Facebook, as a company, is effectively stalking every man, woman, and child on the face of this planet. That is not a feature, no matter how much twisted double-speak you employ to justify their actions.

Re: Why I’m sitting at home crying on a Saturday afternoon

#80

Post by MichaelGG »

danellis wrote: post #39
MichaelGG wrote: post #28

I've no idea why she's put up with FB for long. I've none of the issues she has with Facebook, I just hate it on privacy reasons. So... I don't use it. But if she's gotta use it just submit fake ID. Scan your license or passport, and edit information. This works fine and there is nothing wrong with it. Complaining about their security policies... Eh I'm gonna guess that FB engineers probably want to protect user acco…

> FB is a private company Facebook is a public company. I'm surprised anyone reading HN would have missed their rather high profile IPO.

It's not public as in a utility or other government run or specially regulated utility or something. Their management and decisions regarding most of their features are private.

I don't think it changes the point of my comment at all.

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