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Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

theawl.com

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Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#71

Post by cpeterso »

bambax wrote: post #66
otabdeveloper1 wrote: post #63

For all the people cheering on ad blockers: do you not realize that the _only_ result of wide-spread ad blocking is to drive smaller ad networks out of business and make Google into a monopoly? This is not a win for privacy or security on the Internet. Google is an order of magnitude worse offender compared to the small-time ad networks. And no, you cannot ad block Google. Good luck trying to block google.com cookies…

> you cannot ad block Google Why not? It may be difficult to stop google from tracking you, but if you don't ever see the consequences (as you're blocking their ads), it doesn't much matter does it?

I think the OP means that many websites rely on Google services and will stop working if you block google.com content or cookies.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#72

Post by interpol_p »

otabdeveloper1 wrote: post #63

For all the people cheering on ad blockers: do you not realize that the _only_ result of wide-spread ad blocking is to drive smaller ad networks out of business and make Google into a monopoly? This is not a win for privacy or security on the Internet. Google is an order of magnitude worse offender compared to the small-time ad networks. And no, you cannot ad block Google. Good luck trying to block google.com cookies…

Most ad blockers will block Google's ad network Doubleclick and Google search result ads, Gmail ads, by default. What do you mean when you say one cannot ad block Google?

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#73

Post by cpeterso »

ariwilson wrote: post #51
cpeterso wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ad networks use real-time bidding to auction banner ad space as the page loads. (I imagine that's part of the reason it can take so damn long for some news sites to load.) Why can't the user (or their user agent) take part in this same auction? If I'm will to pay $0.02 per page view on nytimes.com, but advertisers are only willing to pay $0.01 then I should be able to win the auction.

So, exactly this: https://contributor.google.com/u/0/ You even have control over who gets your money: http://i.imgur.com/4Vuuefm.png

Interesting! I thought Google Contributor was more of a direct micropayment system for content, but from that link it looks like real-time bidding.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#74

Post by cpeterso »

Are there any studies that show whether cross-site user tracking actually increases ad click-through rates? An advertiser can already intuit a lot about a reader from the current web site or search terms without tracking their activity on other sites. The most relevant ads I've seen were from Feedly and Twitter, who have their own profiles based on RSS feeds or Twitter accounts I follow.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#75

Post by sireat »

Anecdotal evidence: I was shocked how quickly web degenerates when you disable adblocking.

Start with a reputable major news site, click on one business clickbait article -> a bit sleazy but still somewhat readable site opens -> click on different clickbait article -> sleazier site opens with a lousy article -> click again on ad -> full blown video popup ad extravaganza for rather unsavory business opportunities.

I shudder to think what would have happened if I had chosen to read about medicine or sex.

So in some ways online advertising has the same problem that fashion industry does. The immediate suppliers might be decent but a few steps down you get into OSHA nightmares exported overseas.

The problem is that incentives encourage this sleaziness no matter what high moral standards A,G,F,M, et al profess publicly.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#76

Post by sangnoir »

buffoon wrote: post #37

I love the mantra of "the web is supported by advertising" that every one of these sorts of articles at least quotes. It's not. Shitty business models are supported by advertising. There are plenty of us who provide non-advertising driven services that are profitable and can afford transit costs. As for blocking, the technology allows it so I will use it. If it doesn't allow it, I have no ethical qualms about breakin…

> Shitty business models are supported by advertising.

Just because you do not like it doesn't make it a shitty business model: most sports are supported by advertising (e.g. NFL, UEFA). Endorsement deals, sponsoring teams/stadia/leagues and TV rights are just various forms of advertising.

TV shows are also funded by advertising, as is most journalism that is not state-funded (a.ka. propaganda).

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#77

Post by sangnoir »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #61
jgianakopoulos wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The mantra? This is how the majority of the web is monetized. It's not a mantra, it's a fact. People contribute content to the web and you pay with viewing ads. I don't know how you can rationalize that as being a "shitty" business model just because you purchase a device that is capable of connecting to the internet. If what you really mean to say is that it's a bad business model because people like yourself can in…

I'm with Buffoon on this one. Trying to convince somebody they want to buy something by bombarding them with ads on every web page is shitty. I don't want to be exposed to it. I don't want my kids exposed to it. Then to build your content business on top of the shitty advertising industry that seems kind of a bad idea. I think if people want your content they will pay. Publishers just need to bundle it the right way.…

> I think if people want your content they will pay. Publishers just need to bundle it the right way.

This is incredibly difficult to do and all the attempts I am aware of have 'failed' by varying degrees (paywalls, app.net).

If ad-blocking becomes a trend, I hope the websites as the blockers to pay instead of resorting to "native ads" or going out of business. Hopefully, the internet won't be stratified (rich vs. poor peoples versions of the web), but who am I kidding - happens in all other industries.

However, my opinion is likely coloured by my circumstances: I am a biased 3rd-worlder. I'd prefer the status-quo and have the content I consume subsidised by ads targeted at the western middle class. I would not afford to pay for all the content I find interesting on the internet, especially now with the horrendous USD exchange rate.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#78

Post by Scarblac »

bambax wrote: post #65

> In other words, even the most important and widely respected newspaper in the world is nowhere close to being healthily monetized, especially not by the small number of people who pay for it. It's not true that people won't pay for "content". People subscribe to Netflix, and still go to the theaters in droves (despite "piracy"). People buy games. And it's not even true that there's a problem with written content: p…

There are good arguments for the view that news is actively bad for you: http://dobelli.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Avoid_News_Par... (pdf).

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#79

Post by fwn »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #49

> And there is no way to block the ads shown to you by Facebook or Google or Twitter in their own apps, especially not on mobile. This is not entirely true. AdBlock Plus for Android works at the system level.

AFAIK abp does work by simulating a VPN on your system and therefore being able to block all resources channeled through this VPN. I don't know if that counts as system level. In comparison: Adaway (which needs root) edits the hosts file to block network requests on a system level.

Re: Welcome to the Block Party: The internet after ad blocking

#80

Post by bwohlergo »

einrealist wrote: post #48
_delirium wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's called "retargeting" [1]. In some cases it feels harmless, in others it feels very creepy. I tend to use incognito windows when I search for things I don't want following me around everywhere, to avoid them getting stuck into tracking cookies. But I assume most people don't, so it causes them trouble. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_retargeting

I am constantly affected with this on mobile devices (no ad blocker). It is so intrusive. But its laughable at the same time, because those ad serving engines try to predict me, but show me utter bullshit ads for things I accidently viewed before. So, I really look forward to iOS 9. And whoever provides a proper blocking app will get my money!

ads are the only reason i use firefox on my phone. its the only mobile browser with extension support

thogh thats the only good thing about it... i'd much rather use opera or chrome, as both are better in almost every way

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