A warning about 'model welfare' • Hacker News Board

Re: A warning about 'model welfare'

#691

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Sep 17, 2026, 11:04 PM UTC

thaneross wrote: post #615

moomin wrote: post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, Picard asked a very relevant question to the modern age. What if our societal standards aren't what we thought they were, and we've just had rose-tinted glasses convincing ourselves otherwise. Of course, we never saw them actually deal with that properly, but S1 was a much more interesting series than S2 and S3 were.

The writers flat out rejected Roddenberry's vision of a better future and here's a take on why. We've reached a point in culture of deep pessimism about humanity, and so the characters in Picard are just as dysfunctional as we are.

[deleted]

Re: A warning about 'model welfare'

#692

Post by HarHarVeryFunny » Thu, Sep 17, 2026, 11:05 PM UTC

famouswaffles wrote: post #688

HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #686

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So now you're trying to pivot to consciousness and qualia ? There are other people in this thread who want to talk about that stuff, so try them instead.

>No - suffering in an emotional state, and we'll know if we are choosing to design cognitive architecture with emotions. It's not going to happen accidentally. This was the (your) comment that started this chain. You were already talking about it. If you don't want to keep talking about it then that's fine but let's not act like i'm suddenly pivoting yeah?

What I meant by "emotional state" (AFAIK normal scientific usage) is something with a concrete physical aspect to it - an altered state of mind/body caused by the release of neurotransmitters and/or hormones.

In a conscious animal there is also going to be a subjective experience of that was well, a quale of what it feels like to be in that state if you will, but that is certainly not what I was referring to, as I would have hoped was obvious - I was talking about prediction.

In any case, when the conversation becomes about the conversation, then surely it is time to stop.

Re: A warning about 'model welfare'

#693

Post by verdverm » Thu, Sep 17, 2026, 11:43 PM UTC

NietzscheanNull wrote: post #683

verdverm wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I know it when I see it" is a famous line from a SCOTUS case in the 60's

I know! I should have made that clearer in my original reply. I think it's a bad line now in general, but an even worse justification for the ultimate ruling at the time.

we're all about them vibes as a society right now, surfing towards a post-truth reality of our own construction