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Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

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Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#691

Post by southernplaces7 »

southernplaces7 wrote: post #380

For all his many defects and cloudy motives for doing it, Trump deserves applause for this. It's with actions such as this that he also shows why he's a genuine maverick of a president, with who it's genuinely possible to expect deeply unexpected actions (for better or worse). For all his talk of being progressive and cultivation of a youthful maverick image of his own, you would have never seen such a move from Obam…

Those of you downvoting this comment, I sincerely wonder if it's because you really think Ulbricht deserves to rot the rest of his life in prison despite a deeply flawed, openly vengeful trial and a sentence that simply doesn't usually correspond to any of what he was convicted of in most cases, or because you simply can't, emotionally, approve of anything Trump might do, even if you'd otherwise agree with it.

I'd say either posture is an insult to your own capacity for reasoned thinking, but I am curious about which kind of insult it is.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#692

Post by moogly »

What's even going on? Why is everyone treating this guy as some kind of political prisoner all of a sudden?

I would've expected responses like this for Aung San Suu Kyi or Dawit Isaak or someone, but _this guy_? Really?

Oh, I guess he is an e n t r e p r e n e u r... I get it now.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#694

Post by slavik81 »

jjallen wrote: post #655
mrandish wrote: post #181

This is wonderful. I've never argued that Ross shouldn't have served time but it's always been clear his prosecution and sentencing were excessive and unjust. The prosecutors asked for a 20 year sentence, which seemed disproportionate given the sentencing guidelines for a first-time offender and the non-violent charges he was convicted of. But the judge sentenced Ross to TWO life sentences plus 40 years - without the…

But he’s only served a tiny fraction of what you say was an unjust sentence. So the jury’s still out as to whether he’s served enough time. Other hard drug dealers get way more time than Ross has served. Its astonishing that granting pardons to drug dealers and attempted murderers is something Trump sees as one of the more urgent matters affecting the most powerful nation on Earth. I wish this weren’t true.

He's served over ten years. That's 1/8th of an average lifespan. It would be a fairly normal sentence for second degree murder where I'm from.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#695

Post by chromatin »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #559

We need pardon reform. I’d argue the President should not be allowed to issue pardons that are: (1) Preëmptive ( i.e. absent conviction); (2) To himself, his current or former Cabinet members, or to any of the foregoing’s current or former spouses or children or grandchildren (or their spouses); or (3) Issued after the presidential election in the final year of their term. Furthermore, pardons for violent offences or…

> Preëmptive

amazing use of the diaresis

Regarding the substance of your comment, we do not have (IIRC) established judicial precedent for the constitutionality of preëmptive pardons. The practice originated with Ford pardoning Nixon, and has not yet been challened nor withstood judicial examination.

Personally, I'd like to see some of Biden's pardons challenged.

> (3) Issued after the presidential election in the final year of their term.

This is an interesting one for those who are seeking a second term but are at risk of losing

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#696

Post by [deleted] »

floydnoel wrote: post #428
cogman10 wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish instead of criminalizing addiction we'd fund harm reduction centers and rehabilitation services. I would much rather the police be focused on stopping violent crime rather than these victimless crimes. Legitimizing drugs/prostitution makes is easier to regulate and ultimately make safer. Shoving this stuff into a black/gray market is what ultimately creates violent crime.

no victim means no crime. victimless "crimes" are just 'arbitrary rule' violations (like going 56mph in a 55mph zone) or infractions. the twisting and distortion of language by the state is counterproductive to society.

[deleted]

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#697

Post by Algent »

HlessClaudesman wrote: post #688
I_am_tiberius wrote: post #679

I know he wasn't convicted of hiring a hitman, and I know the attempt didn't succeed, but he still tried to kill other people. Moreover, during a Bitcoin conference, he gave a live talk from prison via phone and still lied, claiming they planted the log on his laptop. A full pardon is ridiculous. It's unfair to so many people, including his partners like Variety Jones, also known as Thomas Clark. On the other hand, I…

Actual murderers get out in the time that Ross served. The concept of justice must include an element of proportionality, I would argue that Ross's sentence, for a first time non-violent criminal, was over the top. Without proportionality justice becomes arbitrary, based more on luck and your connections to power. We punish those we can punish: the little guy. Whilst those running governments, corporations and networ…

Wasn't silk road selling way more than just drugs ? Like, pornography and gun, worldwide. When you facilitate both sex trafficking, organized crime and potentially terrorism you can't exactly be surprised you get hit with everything.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#698

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

HlessClaudesman wrote: post #688
I_am_tiberius wrote: post #679

I know he wasn't convicted of hiring a hitman, and I know the attempt didn't succeed, but he still tried to kill other people. Moreover, during a Bitcoin conference, he gave a live talk from prison via phone and still lied, claiming they planted the log on his laptop. A full pardon is ridiculous. It's unfair to so many people, including his partners like Variety Jones, also known as Thomas Clark. On the other hand, I…

Actual murderers get out in the time that Ross served. The concept of justice must include an element of proportionality, I would argue that Ross's sentence, for a first time non-violent criminal, was over the top. Without proportionality justice becomes arbitrary, based more on luck and your connections to power. We punish those we can punish: the little guy. Whilst those running governments, corporations and networ…

We punish people all the time for non-violent, white-collar crime; often very severely. Bernie Madoff got sent to prison for 150 years and died there and, as far as I know, he never solicited a murder for hire.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#699

Post by ttyprintk »

shoxidizer wrote: post #410
agentultra wrote: post #381

Is this president extremely concerned about drug dealers and gangs in the US? Why is he pardoning a drug trafficker?

Pardoning Ulbricht was a campaign promise he made at the Libertarian National Convention in response to it being a popular demand among the libertarians.

I’d like to know who wrote that speech. A lot of talk about how libertarians are domineered and persecuted. Something like “after criminal prosecutions, if I wasn’t a libertarian then, I sure am now” in front of a very idealistic audience whose skepticism of government is unrelated to how many billionaires it fingerprints. So, they booed and heckled him, and in hindsight I wonder if he was grasping for concessions.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#700

Post by smcameron »

alwa wrote: post #426
wolfgang42 wrote: post #173

Tangentially related: I had the disconcerting experience of reading a Wired article about his arrest[1] while unknowingly sitting about six feet from the spot where he was apprehended. When I read that the FBI agents had stopped at Bello Coffee while preparing their stakeout, I thought, huh, interesting coincidence, I just had a coffee there. Then Ulbricht walked into the public library and sat down at the table dire…

Just as an additional datapoint, since I’m confused by fellow commenters’ confusion—I thought your narrative was clear, colorful, and entertaining, and I hope you’ll keep things so literary and engaging in your future contributions too :) As with so many matters of crime, punishment, and high dudgeon, the physical reality of the situation always feels so banal. Dread Pirate Roberts’ lawless dark kingdom, where he com…

I also wasn't at all confused.
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