According to this Baltimore news report, after 9/11 state officials had looked at putting bumpers around the piers that could have protected the bridge from an impact like this, but it was too expensive. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_-CpdVaHGg
Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
691–700 of 1001 posts
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#692Earlier quoted context omitted.
> in my experience with a 40ft sailboat with a single propeller you have absolutely no rudder authority while reversing. In general it depends on the rudders and the boat. Longer keeled boats don't respond well in reverse at all but more modern boats (like mine, 1990) will do better but will still need some way to have steerage. I can certainly manouver around the marina in reverse, it's just harder than forwards and…
Long keeled boats don't respond well going forward either, right? Compared to flater boats with a modern keel.
Modern flat boats (like the 2017 Dufour I learned on) are highly manouverable at slow speed, we practiced spinning the boat on the spot by using prop wash over the rudder forwards then ticking over in reverse. Could turn the boat in not much more space than the boat length, but may not track as well, may slam more, and make more leeway.
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#693According to this Baltimore news report, after 9/11 state officials had looked at putting bumpers around the piers that could have protected the bridge from an impact like this, but it was too expensive. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_-CpdVaHGg
How could one build a bumper to protect the piers from an impact like this? That ship is massive and it sounds like it was going pretty fast. I'm having trouble imagining any solution that involves absorbing the impact. But I'm not a civil engineer. If something like this exists I'd be interested in reading about it.
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#694There was a video the other week on Reddit where a cargo ship devastated a few loading cranes in a port in Turkey. Now this. How often do cargo ships run into infrastructure? Is this just a coincidence that it happened twice in a few weeks?
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#695Somehow I find it surprising how completely the bridge collapsed after the damage. I understand that a container ship collision is serious, but you could imagine a scenarios where the bridge slumps or buckles but doesn’t just disintegrate like that. It’s surprising that ships capable of doing this damage were probably regularly driving past it, and its safety as a thoroughfare depended entirely on those collisions no…
Simply bulking up the ground around the piers with loose fill or monolithic concrete would have had the ship run aground; at 9mph (the recorded impact speed) the ship would have slowed to a stop within several yards, and suffered minor damage, maybe would have required being tugged back into clear waters. Running aground puts the majority of impact into a downward force absorbed by the earth. It's hard to build a bri…
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#696Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#697Earlier quoted context omitted.
It was blocked off the shortly after the ship pilots sent their mayday signal and declared an emergency, giving the traffic that was on the bridge time to make it through. Most (all?) of the people on the bridge were contractors repairing potholes. > I wonder if it makes sense to protect bridges with pylons like they have in front of buildings to stop cars and trucks. They're called "dolphins" and some bridges do hav…
> It was blocked off the shortly after the ship pilots sent their mayday signal and declared an emergency, giving the traffic that was on the bridge time to make it through. This video makes that a little hard to believe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJNRRdha1Xk . Looks like traffic was crossing up until the last second. Will have to do some more reading as it's very confusing what the ship was doing and what it s…
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#698Earlier quoted context omitted.
The last car crossing that I can see clears the span about 1:28:06; the bridge collapses about 1:28:48. That's about 40 seconds of gap between the traffic and the collapse. I haven't timed how frequently cars are coming, but it seems to be about every 30 seconds or so, which--combined with the time it takes to cross the bridge--is evidence that a bridge closure was effected just before the bridge collapse.
If the police were able to close the bridge just in time, that's a pretty spectacular response. There were only ~5 minutes between the ship loosing power initially and the impact. The police saved lives, and it's only a shame that the construction crew wasn't evacuated in time.
The Washington Post has police audio at the time of the closure (https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2024/03/26/baltimore...). A quick summary of the timeline from that audio:
* There was a request to close the bridge when the ship lost power, which went over police dispatch about a minute before the bridge collapse (the bridge collapse is reported at timestamp 1:09 in the audio).
* Someone was able to hold the outer loop traffic at ~0:20 in the audio, as they reported they were already driving along at the time.
* Inner loop traffic is reported stopped at ~0:56 in the audio. I suspect there may already have been a police car there because of the construction on the bridge.
* Between 0:20 and 0:56, the conversation is about pulling the workcrew off the bridge. The police officer blocking inner loop traffic, after reporting stopping traffic, is indicating that he's waiting for a second unit to arrive before going onto the bridge to collect them.
* At 1:09, the bridge is reported collapsed, and multiple officers confirm. There is a question as to which traffic is stopped--the people blocking inner loop traffic are unable to confirm outer loop stoppage, but the person holding outer loop informs them of the stoppage at the end of the recording.
So traffic seems to have been stopped for about 10-50 seconds before the bridge collapse, depending on the exact length of time between someone stopping traffic and radioing in that they did so. From what I can tell, it sounds like outer loop traffic was stopped in time solely by sheer coincidence, while the inner loop traffic may have been existing police presence (for the construction zone) changing posture to a full closure.
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#699Earlier quoted context omitted.
This disconnect happens with boats quite a lot. For example, I can, by myself, pull a 45 foot grand banks trawler in shallow water. I know because I've done so. But at even very low speeds, I cannot stop it from hitting a pier. I have not tried to do this, but every harbor master has a bunch of stories about people trying to do so and getting a leg or an arm or something squished and pulverized. People who are not bo…
To anyone reading this who isn't an experienced boater: If you are invited onto someone else's boat, sit down and shut up during docking, don't talk to friends, let the captain concentrate. Don't help, if the captain wants you to do something, they will let you know. If you think you know better than the captain, and this advice is unknown to you, you don't know better. Being a good guest during docking shows experie…
Re: Baltimore's Key Bridge struck by cargo ship, collapses
#700According to this Baltimore news report, after 9/11 state officials had looked at putting bumpers around the piers that could have protected the bridge from an impact like this, but it was too expensive. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_-CpdVaHGg
How could one build a bumper to protect the piers from an impact like this? That ship is massive and it sounds like it was going pretty fast. I'm having trouble imagining any solution that involves absorbing the impact. But I'm not a civil engineer. If something like this exists I'd be interested in reading about it.