Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows • Hacker News Board

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#691

Post by codezero » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:16 PM UTC

distant_hat wrote: post #658

codezero wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> mindfully avoid this lifestyle Whoa! I never thought of this, and it seems particularly more apt of an observation with the trend towards legalizing marijuana, and even further, decriminalizing other drugs like mushrooms and LSD. On top of that, games have adopted more and more gambling-like and actual features, and have long been playing on peoples' addictive natures by design.

I don't think you should club together drugs like LSD and mushrooms with pot. I've known nobody addicted to LSD or whose lives are significantly negatively affected by them. Pot, yes, despite the propaganda that it is not addictive, does seem to have a component of addiction and people who take it regularly can't seem to stop talking about it.

I’m clumping them together because there has been a renewed interest in clinical study to treat things like pain and depression, as well as a trend to decriminalize them. Sorry about your friend.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#692

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:20 PM UTC

bjourne wrote: post #396

wutbrodo wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how it's worked out in any society where family formation has been limited for large numbers of young men. The research on the calming effect of family formation on young men is very straightforward: when a population of young men doesn't have the opportunity to form families, _they_ become the powder keg. It's true at multiple scales, from individual criminality to societal unrest.

The theory has not borne out in reality. Japan and China are the countries with the most young incels/sexless men/male virgins per capita are among the most peaceful in the world. It's a good theory, sexual frustration => violence, but it's just not happening.

A causal link might be still there, but the theory might only explain a few percent of the variance, due to many other (confounding) factors.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#693

Post by koonsolo » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:25 PM UTC

geodel wrote: post #598

koonsolo wrote: post #536

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife works with both men and women to fix their problems with finding a good relationship, and what you describe is the most common way of thinking among those men. Most of them are too stubborn to deviate from "they just have to accept me the way I am". Seriously, getting a nice haircut, dressing nicely, grooming yourself and smelling good has nothing to do with your personality. In this sense, men have it way ea…

I mean what you say sounds pretty reasonable. I wonder it also sound reasonable if I say "Well black men have it really easy, they have great skin tone and better physique than average. All they have to do is to not dress like punk or wear hoodies and have hair cut short so they don't have run in with police often"

I thought this was about dating?

Anyway, colored men (mainly indian guys in my wife's practice) significantly increase their attractiveness by dressing nice and well groomed, so same rules apply.

But what I get from your explanation is that it's all the womens fault of not looking past that. Well maybe it's time for you to face reality.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#694

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:37 PM UTC

koonsolo wrote: post #688

troughway wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Women do not want a 'hottie'. I can tell you those women who go out with that 'hottie' have no self esteem, and are not happy. They end up at my wife's practice. Out of curiosity, how do you integrate the online dating studies that point to 70%+ of women only wanting the top 20% of men (ie. the "hotties") into your wife's practice, and what she sees from her clients?

I looked at that data together with my wife, and my analytical mind concluded that it's all bullshit with a clickbait title. Take this for instance: https://medium.com/@worstonlinedater/tinder-experiments-ii-g... , based on 27 women, and he even says himself "Additionally, I am only accounting for the percentage of “likes” and not the actual men they “like”. I have to assume that in general females find the same men…

The OkCupid blog has robust data. Have you looked at that?

Not saying that these studies are not flawed, but the simple fact that Tinder and most of online dating is basically a looks based popularity contest hints at a problem for the median folks.

There's always a lot of new users, there are always a few young new and attractive users. So the majority just waits for the one. So the hot ones pair off, leave the platform (or come back and pair off with other hot ones, then repeat), but the Average Jane and Joe just waste their time and money while having their self-esteem crushed.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#695

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:38 PM UTC

sjg007 wrote: post #453

downerending wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed this among the young men in my extended family and friends. One guy is model cute, and goes out on Tinder "dates" whenever he wants (new girl weekly, at least). He had a live-in girlfriend, but with an open relationship. And if I were one of these women, I'd probably do the same thing. Even if you can't marry a hottie, if you can have sex with one a few times, that still sounds like fun. The other guys,…

The advice to the normal guy in this scenario is to stop smoking pot and hit the gym. That will make up for a lot.

That doesn't help with height, for example.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#696

Post by michaelmrose » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:45 PM UTC

downerending wrote: post #668

michaelmrose wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps you mistakenly believe I said all the people who missing out on human interaction are defective. This isn't so. Lets review context. the parent poster >> “Incel” terrorism is already much more common than class terrorism My response > Them being defective is a problem we can only address by making mental health services more available The subject is people who literally commit acts of terror and murder becaus…

Calling people "defective" is highly pejorative in virtually any context. It's certainly a great way to get people to stop listening.

You can't communicate with people who murder people because they can't get laid. You communicate with the people who are not far gone.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#697

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:47 PM UTC

Grimm1 wrote: post #303

gertlex wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd argue that there's a whole group of young guys who are just so freaking busy and not really in a place where they can meet a bunch of single women ... I'm not sure this is new? I also wonder how large is the group is, and whether this category is as applicable outside of tech (which is a small fraction of the population in my mind). I suspect it's not that large, and groupings by other categories discussed else…

The point poised above was that "Wealthy successful attractive men are having all the sex on demand and that's making it harder for the rest" I offered a counter-view to that thought. Though I guess you could argue the point above isn't that new either. Wealthy attractive men have always been thought to have more sex or have more opportunity to have sex.

But. Do you want sex? And if/when you do how hard/easy it is for you to get it? And especially how easy it is for you to have sex with basically whoever you wish (eg attractive folks)?

Because it's very likely that there is a few percent of the population who are good looking, wealthy and prioritize having lots of sex, and they virtually occupy a much larger share of their target group than their group's size.

So there's a disparity. And lot of men want to emulate that lifestyle, which leads to them constantly not finding appropriate partners.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#698

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:50 PM UTC

apexalpha wrote: post #681

wayoutthere wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

App dating doesn’t work well for a whole lot of people — it‘s really bad if you’re fat, trans, disabled, or even just socially awkward. App culture is about looking for a reason to swipe left rather than finding someone you like and accepting their flaws. It sucks for everyone, it’s just easier for straight cis women under 35 who are able-bodied and of a certain size to get laid.

Appdating was already very popular in the gay scene, so i don't think it only works for straight women under 35.. Furthermore, I think that these apps mostly reflect reality. In the offline world fat people would have a hard time finding dates too. Don't you think?

The problem is that eventually they at least offline find someone. But on apps you can just wait a bit longer, spend a bit more time/money and hope to get lucky.

Most of the problems with online social networks and dating apps are not brand new, just a lot more severe.

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#699

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 5:58 PM UTC

klmadfejno wrote: post #571

johncena33 wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As minority man of color my own experience as well as my friends experience are absolutely in line with what OP has stated. Although I am well-educated, successful and reasonably good-looking, I've a hard time dating. OTOH women of my ethnicity do pretty well in dating market. The only way to explain this phenomenon is hypergamy. Everyone I know in real life (from different genders and ethnicities) acknowledges this.…

> The only way to explain this phenomenon is hypergamy. This statement just does not mesh with the study suggesting the proportion of people getting 0 sex has risen by about 5 percentage point (eyeballing the chart) from 2000 to 2018. Doing some bad-and-wrong-but-making-a-point statistics, if you're getting 0 sex in 2018, the majority of your likelihood of being there was already present in 2000. I'm sure it's harder…

I don't really understand why it isn't consistent with the study. It's entirely possible that people spend a lot more not having sex and waiting for a better partner because these huge dating pools have such a high variance.

So people see that there are very favorable targets on the platform, and their perception is skewed, they start to reject the average matches, they want the best.

So less sex, more hoping for the best.

Am I missing something?

Re: Young U.S. men having a lot less sex in the 21st century, study shows

#700

Post by pas » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 6:08 PM UTC

evv555 wrote: post #389

akiselev wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both the Islamic State and Taliban were formed by soldiers and insurgents left over from military invasions of the Middle East. The former came to prominence thanks to a lot of Bathists in the aftermath of the Iraq invasion - many were officers during Saddam's regime - and the latter by the mujahideen, who fought the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and had plenty of military hardware left over to form a powerful army…

"How the Islamic State recruits young men by kidnapping girls to be their sex slaves" https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/13/islamic-state-re...

Non-paywalled: https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/kidnapped-sex-slaves-help-is...