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Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

arstechnica.com

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Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#681

Post by plasticbugs »

gizmo wrote: post #37

Based on the encyclopedic knowledge LLMs have of written works I assume all parties did the same. But I think there is a broader point to make here. Youtube was initially a ghost town (it started as a dating site) and it only got traction once people started uploading copyrighted TV shows to it. Google itself got big by indexing other people's data without compensation. Spotify's music library was also pirated in the…

I briefly worked for Crunchyroll, which began life as an anime pirating service with subtitles. The contracts with the Japanese anime publishers came later. Now they vigorously protect their content from "pirates".

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#682

Post by demosthanos »

kshri24 wrote: post #666
demosthanos wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One of the main outcomes of imperialism/colonization is denigrating/destroying/appropriating works of art, literature with the primary goal of subjugation, subversion and thereupon replacement of native culture/traditions/institutions. Which is irrelevant to the question of whether copyright law within the country of England and within English culture is beneficial or not. It is the nature of racism that it bypasse…

> Which is irrelevant to the question of whether copyright law within the country of England and within English culture is beneficial or not It is irrelevant from your POV because you don't see anything wrong in IP violations when it comes to Knowledge being taken out of India, credit removed and then reproduced in European Languages, including English, as if it was some novel discovery. So those who indulged in this…

> It is irrelevant from your POV because you don't see anything wrong in IP violations when it comes to Knowledge being taken out of India, credit removed and then reproduced in European Languages, including English, as if it was some novel discovery.

Uh, no, I didn't say that.

There's no point in writing to you if no matter what I say you're going to just make up stuff you think I believe and respond to that instead of to my actual words.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#683

Post by tredre3 »

erikerikson wrote: post #501
Workaccount2 wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the single biggest thing I learned growing up is that you can safely live by "Everyone is in it for themselves". It's incredibly rare to find people who hold ideals that are detrimental to their own life.

This hasn't been my observation. Instead, I see a society where people regularly help and serve one other, frequently for free. Consider parents, social workers, most academics, food banks, charity in general, most workers in most businesses, et cetera. I wonder: who do you know and work with? A minority of people profit wonderfully off this. Incidentally, they seem to also preach principals that can only lead to the…

I don't disagree with your point that, in life, not everybody is in it for themselves. But the examples you chose to demonstrate altruism are a bit ridiculous:

- parents: they wanted a child and now they have to take care of it, it's not a selfless act at all

- social workers: are paid to pretend to care. Often they genuinely do care, but this isn't altruism, it's a job

- most academics: I see you haven't met many academics. Altruistic (and selfless) are not terms I would use to describe them. The majority is very much in it for themselves...

- food banks, charity in general: very true, some charity do strive on unpaid volunteers, that is altruism

- most workers in most businesses: okay now you're getting ridiculous...

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#684

Post by golly_ned »

abigail95 wrote: post #674

This reminds me of Peter Sunde's "komimashin" https://www.engadget.com/2015-12-21-peter-sunde-kopimashin.h... It's obviously absurd to enforce copyright as bytes are copied around instead of as it is used. Training an LLM is a different thing than re-hosting and giving away copies to other people. If you don't want people to transform your works - keep them private. You don't own ideas.

As the article says, Meta /was/ giving away copies to other people by seeding the libgen torrents. This isn't the usual case of "should companies be allowed to train on books".

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#685

Post by arp242 »

twelve40 wrote: post #599
arp242 wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really screwed over a lot of regular working-class people. In some European cities getting a taxi license was a serious monetary investment. People took our huge loans for this. This was now suddenly worthless. It's like being told your very expensive university education is no longer accredited, but the student loan still exists. kthxbye. I'm not saying the existing systems were always good (they weren't), but yo…

> getting a taxi license was a serious monetary investment. People took our huge loans for this it was a terrible system that sucked for everyone involved. For all of Uber's flaws, would you rather go back to that today? really??

> would you rather go back to that today? really??

I absolutely said said no such thing. There are good ways to change things and bad ways to change things. Allowing a private entity reap huge profits by blatantly breaking rules and screwing people is not a good way to change things.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#686

Post by [deleted] »

DebtDeflation wrote: post #184
rchaud wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airbnb and Uber have showed us that laws matter only to the extent that the political will to enforce them exists. Throw enough lawyers and lobbying money at the problem and the laws can simply be re-written to be friendlier to your business model.

The reason there was no political will to punish Airbnb and Uber for violating the law was that initially they were subsidized with VC money and so were able to undercut traditional hotels and taxis on price. In the world of tradable goods, pricing below cost with the intent of putting competition out of business so you can raise prices later is known as "dumping" and is itself illegal.

[deleted]

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#687

Post by tredre3 »

HeatrayEnjoyer wrote: post #654
HDThoreaun wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why comment if you have no idea what youre talking about?

I've written my own torrent clients. Have you?

So have I. So we both know that it's possible to not seed a torrent while downloading it.

It's even possible to pretend to seed whilst not transferring anything, just to boost your ratio on a private tracker.

That's the protocol we're talking about.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#688

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

gizmo wrote: post #37

Based on the encyclopedic knowledge LLMs have of written works I assume all parties did the same. But I think there is a broader point to make here. Youtube was initially a ghost town (it started as a dating site) and it only got traction once people started uploading copyrighted TV shows to it. Google itself got big by indexing other people's data without compensation. Spotify's music library was also pirated in the…

"Spotify's music library was also pirated in the early days."

"Ek, who had been the CEO of the piracy platform uTorrent, founded Spotify with his friend, another entrepreneur named Martin Lorentzon. Both-Ek at 23 and Lorentzon 37-were already millionaires from the sales of previous businesses. The name Spotify had no particular meaning, and was not associated with music. According to Spotify Teardown, the company developed a software for improved peer-to-peer network sharing, and the founders spoke of it as a general "media distribution platform." The initial choice to focus on music, the founders said at the time, was because audio files are smaller than video files, not because of a dream of saving music.

In 2007, when Spotify first publicly tested its software, it allowed users to stream songs downloaded from The Pirate Bay, a service for unlicensed downloads. By late 2008, Spotify would convince music labels in Sweden to license music to the site, and unlicensed music was removed. From there, Spotify would take off across Europe and then the world."

https://qz.com/1683609/how-the-music-industry-shifted-from-n...

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#689

Post by hnpolicestate »

swozey wrote: post #609
throwawaygmbno wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone on here is smart enough. Just do not participate and save your money. Do not pay for digital goods. If Netflix raises their prices, it doesn't matter because there is a torrent of all of their shows. If Spotify raises their prices, it doesn't matter because your favorite artist has their entire library in a torrent. If some game company ask you to pay real life prices for a digital costume, find the crack on…

lol I absolutely do not want non digital goods nor pirating. Ever. It's 2025. I don't have a cdplayer, a tape player, a blue ray player, I don't even know what the most modern "blue ray" disc would be. I have $2k worth of vinyls that are just unique copies I display as art I'll never put in my record player, that's also never been used. I don't want to constantly worry about 60gb of mp3 files. Oh no, that TV show I'l…

You're arguing for media as a service. I think many people are tired of the SASS everything model. It's generally user hostile, you need multiple different services, there are dark patterns and you still have to endure ads. Privacy issues too. Piracy is definitely superior.

Re: Meta torrented & seeded 81.7 TB dataset containing copyrighted data

#690

Post by wil421 »

Snild wrote: post #641
crazygringo wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure there's any legal distinction though. Is a book publicly available? No, you have to purchase it. But once you do, you're legally allowed to let your friends and family and so forth read it too. As long as you don't sell copies of it (the "copy" part of "copyright"), or meaningfully take away the ability for the publisher to make money from sales (so you can't post it for the whole world to see on the int…

I don't know what the deal is in the relevant jurisdictions, but in Swedish copyright law, the provenance of the original matters ("lovlig förlaga"). This means that it's not legal to download a rip of e.g. a CD that was uploaded without consent, even if you own a copy. (This exception to the general right to make copies for private use was added in 2005 to make downloading illegal -- previously, only uploading was i…

I believe the most famous cases in the US have only gone after the people sharing or seeding or uploading content. My ISP could care less what I download from use net but they will definitely care when I start seating.
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