OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show • Hacker News Board

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#681

Post by [deleted] » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:02 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #650

qarl wrote: post #644

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. And that's extremely hard to believe. A discovery search of the internal emails should give us a definitive answer.

To find this "extremely hard to believe", you have to argue that this story, which has multiple sources unaffiliated with OpenAI, contemporaneous documentary evidence, and is written by a reporter with every incentive in the world to roast OpenAI, is directly wrong about facts plainly reported in the story. I think you have to want this story to be wrong to think it's wrong. It's a tough beat! Everyone was super sure…

[deleted]

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#682

Post by scoot » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:03 PM UTC

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #303

scoot wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They contacted Johansson after the Sky voice was created, they didn’t create it because she declined. The voice actor isn’t a Johansson imitator, and the voice isn’t an imitation. The only similarity between the Sky voice and Johansson’s is that it’s a white American female, so by your logic a significant percentage of the US population has a case.

> They contacted Johansson after the Sky voice was created, they didn’t create it because she declined. Her statement says otherwise: "Last September, I received an offer from Sam Altman, who wanted to hire me to voice the current ChatGPT 4.0 system. He told me that he felt that by my voicing the system, I could bridge the gap between tech companies and creatives and help consumers to feel comfortable with the seismi…

> Her statement says otherwise

In what way?

That in no way contradicts the fact that the Sky voice was created first, although it does seem to suggest a misunderstanding by Johansson that this was to be an exclusive deal to be "the" voice, leading to the incorrect conclusion that the Sky voice was created after she declined, and must therefore be an impersonation (despite sounding nothing like her/Her, as she herself must know better than anyone). Stretch after stretch after stretch. (Being kind.)

In fact the recordings used for training were made in June/July 2023, which is before Johansson was contact as a possible "also-ran": https://openai.com/index/how-the-voices-for-chatgpt-were-cho...

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#683

Post by spiralk » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:03 PM UTC

jmull wrote: post #631

Well, here are some things that aren't really being disputed: * OpenAI wanted an AI voice that sounds like SJ * SJ declined * OpenAI got an AI voice that sounds like SJ anyway I guess they want us to believe this happened without shenanigans, but it's bit hard to. The headline of the article is a little funny, because records can't really show they weren't looking for an SJ sound-alike. They can just show that those…

Sky does not really sound like SJ though if you listen side by side. According to OAI's timeline, they intended to have Sky in addition to SJ. OAIs voice models including Sky predate the GPT4o voice assistant. Also:

"In a statement from the Sky actress provided by her agent, she wrote that at times the backlash “feels personal being that it’s just my natural voice and I’ve never been compared to her by the people who do know me closely.”"

It did not seem like an issue before and the Sky voice was public many months before GPT4o. I don't believe SJ can claim to own all young, attractive woman voices whether they are used as a voice assistant or not. It seems like the issue is being blown out of proportion. It does make a good story. The public perception of AI right now is generally negative and people are looking for reasons to disparage AI companies. Maybe there are good reasons sometimes, but this one is not it.

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#684

Post by rcyeh » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:04 PM UTC

DoctorOetker wrote: post #375

naasking wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So its: ask Johansson, get declined, ask casting directors for the type of voice actors they are interested in, listened to 400 voices, choose one that sounds like the actor Except it doesn't sound like Johansson, I don't know why people keep saying this. At best, the voice has a couple of similar characteristics, but I didn't think for one second that it was her. Can James Earl Jones sue if someone uses a voice ac…

Also looking from the perspective of the lesser known voice actress, does Scarlett Johansson have the right to trample the lesser known voice artists future job opportunities by intimidating her previous employers? Imagine being a potential future employer of the lesser known artist, would you dare hire her in the face that Johansson's lawyers might come after you? Is this lesser known voice artist now doomed to find…

This is exactly the right argument. Accepting the lawsuit would give precedent to an insidious combination: Matthew+chilling effect

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#685

Post by P_I_Staker » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:04 PM UTC

hehdhdjehehegwv wrote: post #629

monocasa wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Copying likeness can be.

Not for commercial purposes and not in California. Otherwise you’d just hire an impersonator and never pay for celebrity endorsement.

Worth pointing out that this doesn't really do the same thing. Some percentage of the time it will be detected by some of your customers and it won't work the same for them.

It's not just about seeing a celeb face. There's more going on that was discovered in the 80's and 90's, I think (that's when it became a big thing at least).

Built into it is the implication that the celeb likes the product. Additionally, products and branding have become a part of our personalities (IMO bad trend). So in a way you can BE like the celeb.

You will be just as cool as michael jackson if you just hold a pepsi in your hand. Sure, none of us really think this at face value, however it's implied and hinted at.

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#686

Post by mastax » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:06 PM UTC

asaxena76 wrote: post #666

giobox wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Movie Her predates all of this by years, and Sam Altman even tweeted "her"! The OpenAI team are clearly well aware of Scarlett's voice (its inconceivable the majority of the team at OpenAI haven't at least seen part of the film that almost defined their industry). The movie predates all of this by years - of course they knew. When auditioning actors "months before" they can still look for an actor who guess what?…

Even if thats true why would that be illegal or unethical? She can't possibly have a copyright on all voices that sounds like "her"

There have been cases where it was decided that a person had rights[0] to their distinctive voice, as an extension of the Right of Publicity[1]. For example Midler v. Ford Motor Co.[2], and one or two other cases I've seen mentioned but can't remember.

[0]: Though not necessarily "copyrights"?

[1]: https://higgslaw.com/celebrities-sue-over-unauthorized-use-o...

[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midler_v._Ford_Motor_Co.

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#687

Post by veidr » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:08 PM UTC

CosmicShadow wrote: post #628

Kind of concerning to see so much sketchbag behaviour from possibly the top AI company so consistently. Sure brings a lot of confidence in the future and sad that they can get away with it and still succeed because of the tech and their big names. It feels like it took years before people started hating Google and Tesla, but these guys wasted very little time pretending to be good. Do I still pay for and use them? Un…

I feel like this is the most important comment I read before giving up — Altman seems to have tried to move fast and break things (a dubious strategy at best) but now he's going full Musk/Shkreli.

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#688

Post by pclmulqdq » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:08 PM UTC

asaxena76 wrote: post #666

giobox wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Movie Her predates all of this by years, and Sam Altman even tweeted "her"! The OpenAI team are clearly well aware of Scarlett's voice (its inconceivable the majority of the team at OpenAI haven't at least seen part of the film that almost defined their industry). The movie predates all of this by years - of course they knew. When auditioning actors "months before" they can still look for an actor who guess what?…

Even if thats true why would that be illegal or unethical? She can't possibly have a copyright on all voices that sounds like "her"

NIL rights are pretty broad, and more like trademark rights than patents or copyrights. The main test isn't similarity, it's whether there is brand confusion. Karpathy and Altman's tweets indicate brand confusion.

Still, this isn't recognized in every state or country, and there aren't many cases yet (although there are laws).

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#689

Post by lupusreal » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:12 PM UTC

gnicholas wrote: post #59

tivert wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They used a different person, so it is not her voice. That doesn't matter because it's an impersonation. Ford lost, even though they didn't use Bette Midler's voice either: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midler_v._Ford_Motor_Co .

It seems like the key difference is that the advertisements in those cases involved people who sounded like particular musical artists, singing songs that those artists were well-known for singing. If you hired the woman who voiced Sky to say lines that Scarlett had in some of her movies, that would be similar. The fact that this is a chatbot makes it somewhat of an echo of those cases, but it strikes me (a former la…

Tom Waits sued Frito Lay for using an impersonator to sing about Doritos.

Re: OpenAI didn’t copy Scarlett Johansson’s voice for ChatGPT, records show

#690

Post by HarHarVeryFunny » Thu, May 23, 2024, 4:12 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #670

HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #668

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearly an SJ voice was the goal, given that Altman asked her to do it, asked her a second time just two days before the ChatGPT-4o release, and then tweeted "her" on the release day. The next day Karpathy, recently ex-OpenAI, then tweets "The killer app of LLMs is Scarlett Johansson". Altman appears to be an habitual liar. Note his recent claim not to be aware of the non-disparagement and claw-back terms he had depa…

They hired the actor that did the voice months before they contacted SJ . The reaction on this site to the news that this story was false is kind of mindbending.

Sure, no-one is disputing that, and despite this Altman then contacts SJ again two days before release asking her to reconsider, then tweets "her" to remind the public what he was shooting for. The goal could have just been ChatGPT with a voice interface, but instead Altman himself is saying the the goal was specifically to copy "her".