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Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

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Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#681
post #633

My concerns about this were theft, mistakes, cost to operate, and opportunity costs. Theft is an obvious one. It happens in self checkouts in many ways. We had people come into our store to just leave with baskets of stuff, load their pockets, take stuff from one box to put in a cheaper one they bought, or even put raw eggs and meat in their pockets. That was with a ton of workers in the store looking out for thieves…

People can put stuff into their pockets during regular checkout too, no? > take stuff from one box to put in a cheaper one isn't the scale supposed to catch this? > predicted how many registers we needed that seems like the dumbest because No.1. useless thing in a supermarket where cashiers see the lines :D

Many thieves are cowards, too. They steal less when they think people are watching. Their risk analysis is based on if people are there, if cameras are there, if they think people really watch thieves on camera, and if the store prosecutes thieves. Every box you tick can reduce theft. I think Target was in the lead on that stuff.

Re scales. The scale detects a weight difference between items. If the items are similar weight, the scale or cashier will ignore it. The scales also had a high, false alarm rate that often caused cashiers to ignore them. The thieves also use scanning methods that cause higher, false alarms to encourage that. None of that works with human cashiers and a bascart exchange.

Re registers needed. You would think. The company was top-down, micro-managed, low staff, and blame the worker. The supervisor had to open registers in time, maybe watch self-checkout while the attendant does price checks, and often work a register themselves for most of the shift. Good service was impossible in those conditions.

Instead of having cashiers, the executives decided an AI that thought for us would fix the problem. Of course, we had no cashiers to open registers. They marked us as failures on that, too.

Later, they had us force more people to use self-checkout, closed more registers to facilitate that process, and installed more self checkouts. I’ve been gone a few years. It seems the customers have grudgingly accepted the status quo because both major companies, the cheapest with most products, were intentionally making checkout terrible. Oligopolies in action…

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#682

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not India, but my favorite example was the Kiwi food delivery robot fleet in Berkeley, CA. They were controlled manually from Colombia, and from the looks of it, seems like one person was trying to drive 20 robots at once.

A lot of these robot delivery things need to go out with a human handler 100 yards back lest people try and kick them open it seems. Whats the point at that point? Just have the person walk it over.

These ones didn't have a human handler. I think a lot of them just got broken into. I've also seen one get run over by a truck before because it wandered into the road.

Also, even if nothing went wrong, they were so slow that I can't imagine people actually used them. Wonder if they were just pretending to deliver stuff.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#684

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bricklayer work isn't classified as unskilled labor nor are masonry helpers. Neither are jobs like carpenters, roofers, pipelayers, cooks, truck drivers, clerks and many, many others.

I never said any of those were...

What unskilled labor were you referring to a brickie using then?

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#685
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never experienced one reliable enough for this to be true (for me).

This surprises me. I regularly get in line and fully complete self-checkout before anyone who was there when I started scanning, even though I'm typically checking out with more items. What's causing the struggle? Every one of these works the same at every store - scan barcode, place item on the weight plate. Repeat. Press pay button, pay with card, whatever, tap/insert.

> scan barcode, place item on the weight plate. Repeat. Press pay button, pay with card, whatever, tap/insert.

scan barcode, place item on plate mostly works except when barcode is crumpled or something.

without barcodes it's a more of a crapshoot. Usually more than 1/2 of my basket doesn't have a barcode (fresh produce, etc.)

Maybe the ones near me are just too sensitive to weight variations.

Oh and one of them really loves to scan a points card 2x, then try an apply the second read as a product and fail.

Every time the machine gets confused, you have to wait for an attendant. All things being equal, the cashiers are faster than self scan. If the lineup for cashiers is longer, it can still be faster, but otherwise it's slower in my experience.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#686
post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is it a fraud? Did they ever tell you it was entirely computer-driven? I thought their value proposition was you could just ... walk out. This feels pretty inescapably the future. Why have people do bad jobs like cashier work when computers could do them instead? This is why UBI is going to be critical. We're moving to a world where we'll have more people than work, and that's not just ok - it's fantastic. They'r…

> Our checkout-free shopping experience is made possible by the same types of technologies used in self-driving cars: computer vision, sensor fusion, and deep learning. Our Just Walk Out Technology automatically detects when products are taken from or returned to the shelves and keeps track of them in a virtual cart. When you're done shopping, you can just leave the store. A little later, your receipt will be availab…

Thanks for answering his question.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#687
post #573

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pizza Hut has in store seating, Dominoes does not.

If Dominos is a logistics company then Pizza Hut is both a logistics company and a dine-in restaurant.

I believe that Dominos would include the delivery as part of its core competencies and business value that distinguishes it from other pizza companies while others do not consider delivery as part of their core business.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#688
post #598

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also paying the extra premium (whether Deliveroo, Just Eat or Uber Eats) for first delivery is kinda pointless (at least here in the South West) as the drivers seem to be delivering for all the apps at the same time, so your delivery takes 35 mins for the 10 min premium delivery and sometimes they even turn off GPS after they've picked it up if they're delivering for another app first. So expensive for a frustrating…

I think that's the real difference under all this - Dominos employs drivers (and they get paid by tips, sure there are issues) but it's all one thing. If they deliver a cold pizza it's on them. All the delivery app companies are NOT making the food so the blame game starts AND they are not employees so a bunch of gaming is going on. I know my one experience with Uber eats is such that I'll never use it again, and ins…

Also food delivery drivers employed directly by restaurants typically have an insulated carrier in their car or on their bike to keep your food warm. Uber Eats drivers don't so the food gets cold way faster.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#689
post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think a further improvement on a system like that would be to use the cheap RFID tech Unfortunately I doubt you'll ever see this happen. Sure, it's supposedly possible to buy an RFID chip for 1p - but you can buy a can of beans for 23p so that 1p is probably their entire profit margin. I've also worked with a variety of RFID readers; none of them can provide reliable reading, even in favourable conditions.

Exactly how many beans does this 23p 'can' contain? Is it more than a dozen?

https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/products/258290127

If my Business Studies teacher ~20 years ago was, and still is, correct then they are a loss leader.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#690
post #605

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious as to how food delivery worked in your country before Uber et al. In the UK, outside of corporate chains, it was largely a cash in hand operation for both the restaurants and drivers. Drivers would typically be paid a small sum for showing up on the night and then keep the delivery charge and any tips. The cost to the restaurant was pretty much negligible. The middle-men, in addition to their own cut, hav…

> Drivers would typically be paid a small sum for showing up on the night and then keep the delivery charge and any tips. Under that model, wouldn't drivers only want to work for the busiest restaurants? With delivery apps, a restaurant can have just a few orders per night and still be open for delivery. I would bet that there's an order of magnitude more deliveries happening (and drivers working) these days vs pre-U…

> Under that model, wouldn't drivers only want to work for the busiest restaurants?

It doesn't take many orders to keep an individual driver busy. Typically the restaurants would manage how many, and which, drivers worked each night. If the night was unexpectedly quiet then a driver might finish early.

> With delivery apps, a restaurant can have just a few orders per night and still be open for delivery.

Yeah, the main benefit of delivery apps is enabling restaurants who primarily serve sit-in diners to deliver also. The overall benefit to delivery focused restaurants is much more tenuous.

> I would bet that there's an order of magnitude more deliveries happening (and drivers working) these days vs pre-Uber.

Perhaps, but if a driver was already busy all night under the previous model, then they're potentially harmed by the current model.

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