Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

greenwald.substack.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

671–680 of 696 posts

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#671

Post by saulpw »

ClayShentrup wrote: post #667
saulpw wrote: post #464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard the arguments for approval voting, and I'm sure it's all the things you mention and more, but people don't get it . I don't get it. I don't want to vote for both Hillary and Bernie. I want to vote for Bernie, and then only if Bernie can't win , would I let my vote go to Hillary. You can explain to me until you're blue in the face why approval is strictly better even in this situation, but I am emotionally…

LOL, people get it just fine. fargo adopted it by a 64% supermajority and st louis adopted it by a 68% supermajority. https://approval.vote/ > You can explain to me until you're blue in the face why approval is strictly better even in this situation, but I am emotionally attached to my vote counting for Bernie more than any other candidate, so reason isn't going to work on my lizard brain. but your actual strategy is…

Welp, you just proved my point. I still don't get it. I want to vote my preference and I don't want to vote Hillary and Bernie equally. shrug.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#672

Post by vkou »

JCattheATM wrote: post #627
vkou wrote: post #584

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No one said anything about retaining footage forever. It's inevitably what happens.

It doesn't have to be, but that brings us back to the problem being an apathetic or misinformed population.

So, what you propose only works if people weren't people..?

I'm going to have to do a hard 'hell no', in that case.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#673

Post by JCattheATM »

vkou wrote: post #672
JCattheATM wrote: post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't have to be, but that brings us back to the problem being an apathetic or misinformed population.

So, what you propose only works if people weren't people..? I'm going to have to do a hard 'hell no', in that case.

Well, not just what I propose but a lot of aspects of society would be improved if we could subject people to mandatory reeducation and/or limit who gets to vote. Even just requiring a college degree to vote, or a simple quiz testing knowledge of what is being voted on would do wonders.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#674

Post by baobabKoodaa »

whycome wrote: post #53
baobabKoodaa wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No marketing team would willingly do this and it's insane to think otherwise.

Insane is a bit hyperbolic. The history of marketing is full of grand mistakes that seem absurd in hindsight.

That is exactly what I'm saying! I'm saying this was a mistake (not intentional). Read my post again if you are confused.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#675

Post by kortilla »

wredcoll wrote: post #469
kortilla wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The industrial revolution is quite well documented

Things people did, sure, but not why they did them here and not there is a bit trickier. There's a variety of theories, easy access to coal is my favorite, but some people like to blame the magna carta or something.

Check out Destiny Disrupted. It covers how the Middle East and China both had technology opportunities much earlier but were missing the right economic incentives at the time to handle the disruption to the labor force that came with the Industrial Revolution.

Essentially the major societies before ended up in local maximums because they didn’t have the ruthlessness of capitalism or the economic desperation to adopt technologies that in the short term would unemploy large portions of society and wipe out old power structures.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#676

Post by nobody9999 »

ClayShentrup wrote: post #668
nobody9999 wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A ranked choice ballot at least requires you to assign a unique value to every candidate on the ballot: you can honestly rank your second choice without being concerned that doing so undermines your first. That's highly implementation dependent. Where I live we have ranked-choice ballots for local primary elections, while the local general elections are FPTP. State and Federal elections are all FPTP for primary and…

it's the worst of the commonly discussed alternatives. https://www.rangevoting.org/BayRegsFig

Thank you for your expert opinion. Unlike yourself and your colleague[0], I am not an expert on voting systems and infrastructure.

I am just a consumer of such things and have exactly zero say in my town's approach to voting.

I do know that RCV is better than FPTP, even more so if we don't, at least, require a majority, and am glad my town is at least making a start at such things.

That said, I'd love to make it even better.

As I suggested[1] to your colleague, it would be terrific if your expertise could be used to improve the voting system where I live.

I'd expect that the folks[2] who make such decisions could be convinced to re-frame things in another referendum based upon the recommendations of you and your organization. I know I'd certainly appreciate it!

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47035812

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47036908

[2] https://www.vote.nyc/page/contact-us

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#677

Post by danesparza »

api wrote: post #248
danesparza wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What evidence do you have the Glenn Greenwald wants a strongman? If anything, he has been attacked by numerous 'strong men' (in various governments!) over several years.

Greenwald supports both Putin and Trump, for starters. He's either insanely clueless, a propagandist who is being dishonest about his goals, or an accelerationist who thinks making things worse will make them better after (magic happens here). The magic never happens. Any political program that boils down to (1) break everything, (2) magic, (3) things are better, really goes (1) break everything, (2) either things st…

"Greenwald supports both Putin and Trump, for starters."

I'd really appreciate it if you backed up this claim. If anything, I've seen him be sharply critical of the current administration in the US. I'm unfamiliar with his coverage of Putin.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#679

Post by otterley »

keernan wrote: post #664
otterley wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you haven't really studied 1A law in a long time, if you ever did. These fact patterns have not been well tested in court. They look similar to some cases, but are quite distinguishable, too. They might be 1A violations because of the chilling effect they could have on speech, but I'm not going out on a limb to say with certainty that they are; and I don't know any competent attorney who would. > The government…

I have always been a civil trial attorney, much of the time before state Equity Judges ( generally more qualified than our law division judges ). It's been a very long time since law school ( admitted to the bar in 1977 ). Having said that, my posts had nothing to do with the 'realities' of winning in court regarding the activities outlined. Rather my point is the activities are clearly unconstitutional by any conven…

> the activities are clearly unconstitutional by any conventional analysis by any qualified US attorney. Whether or not you could develop the requisite proofs is another matter entirely

I assume that when you say "develop the requisite proofs," you mean "prevail in court." In Constitutional law, these are inseparable and an outcome of Marbury v. Madison. The Court says what the law is. If the Court's opinion is that the Government's behavior is permitted by the Constitution, then it follows that the behavior is Constitutional; and because our law relies on precedent, that interpretation is rather sticky. It does so happen that from time to time, we overturn precedent--and I hope we do, because we have some pretty bad law out there--but until then, we rely on it to predict the outcome of future cases.

> There can be zero doubt that the subpoena upon Google violated due process. Being an administrative subpoena, there was no judge involved but due process ( eg probable cause ) is still required and - absent some wildly unimaginable set of unknown facts - there was clearly no probable cause here.

Yeah, I agree. The problem is, without some sort of injury, there's likely no standing, and so the case will probably never see the light of day.

Re: Amazon's Ring and Google's Nest reveal the severity of U.S. surveillance state

#680

Post by Schiendelman »

embedding-shape wrote: post #108
Schiendelman wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple isn't on the evil list, aside from the kowtowing every powerful leader must do not to have their business attacked.

> Apple isn't on the evil list Yeah, Tim Apple handing over a 24-karat gold plaque to the sitting president is completely normal behavior for CEOs to engage in, and not at all about just making as much money as possible. He had to do that, otherwise Apple as a company would disappear tomorrow. They're just trying to survive.

I know you're being sarcastic, but yes, that's exactly what's happening. And it's really hard to fight this kind of corruption when your allies get sarcastic and angry at you instead of listening and discussing. Please consider reading the HN guidelines and thinking about how your comment might not be aligned with them.

Hank Green has a really good video about how this is happening here: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jOR4wuiPeEQ

Post reply on HN