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Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

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Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#671

Post by nimish »

bri3d wrote: post #620
Kwpolska wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modems are harder to get right than CPUs. A CPU needs to do math and work with digital data lines. A modem needs to talk to the mobile network, using radios, and a bunch of standards that were built up since the 90s.

Tacking on: the devil in a modern baseband is in the firmware. The analog domain stuff is generally handled by increasingly commoditized RF frontends outside of the baseband processor, and then either clean analog IQ or more recently, even digital samples (DAC and ADC moved to frontend) are sent to the baseband processor. A baseband is a really fancy specialized SDR. Most are based on arcane VLIW DSP architectures li…

If you look at the math it's not even that complicated. Basic statistical inference and information theory.

Seems like the difficult part is doing that effectively while avoiding IP issues -- patents on software and math have entrenched Qualcomm's dominance.

Imagine if all of the IP for ML or AI were held by a single company that got the regulating body (ITU/3GPP) to require their use. Makes a mockery of FRAND terms.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#672

Post by asdff »

musictubes wrote: post #569
asdff wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easily the nicest form factor phone they ever produced. You can reach the entire screen with the thumb in one hand without awkwardly flopping the phone onto the thumb in the farthest corner. It is smaller than your wallet. The battery lasted forever because the screen was small and not that bright or nearly so pixel dense. Too bad the management consultants killed such a technology.

There’s no conspiracy. Not enough people like small phones. Apple’s biggest spike happened once they ditched the iPhone 5 size and went to bigger phones with the iPhone 6. I’m willing to bet it was some people in management that missed the small phones and fought to re-introduce a smaller form factor phone. They succeeded in making the best small phones ever made and rounding down approximately nobody bought them. Bl…

Apple sells how few Mac Pros a year and still sells them? They could ship another couple skus. One of the largest tech companies on the face of the earth and you are telling me they can't ship a cellphone.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#673

Post by tverbeure »

uticus wrote: post #504
ksec wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except making a decent modem is indeed harder than start of art CPU. People loves to shit on Qualcomm but dont appreciate that amount of work involved.

I would buy that a decent modem is harder than many CPU designs, maybe even most. But harder than state-of-the-art? Surely not, have you seen the complexity? And even CPUs (esp state of art) have to worry about radio effects, as in avoiding internally and across chipset.

I never worked on radio modems, but I've worked on wireline modems: the issue is not the math or the standard algorithms, it's making it interoperable with everything that's existing out there and all environment conditions while working around bugs of other implementations.

It is a ridiculous amount of work and if you're new to the business, it takes a long time just to be build the lab test suite. And you need to support not just the latest and greatest protocols but also legacy ones. The operators have their own say and test labs as well and they all have slightly different setups and requirements.

> And even CPUs (esp state of art) have to worry about radio effects, as in avoiding internally and across chipset.

Radio effect are rarely an issue with regular chips. Crosstalk within a chip only happens between wires that are within hundreds of nanometers separated from each other.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#674

Post by BenjiWiebe »

enragedcacti wrote: post #446
BenjiWiebe wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If small phones are difficult, why are phones getting larger as battery and semiconductor tech continues to improve? Advances in tech should allow phones to be smaller than ever for the same capabilities, or more capabilities for the same size than ever before.

> why are phones getting larger as battery and semiconductor tech continues to improve? I don't doubt that the average phone has grown in size, the base iPhone has stayed roughly the same size for 7 years at this point. The 16 is only 0.15"x0.03"x0.01" larger than the iPhone X from 2017 and the base iPhone peaked in height and width all the way back in 2019 with the iPhone 11. I think the simple answer is that they'v…

I just wish there'd be a modern phone with the same form factor as the 2013 Moto X. Actually I see that the Jelly Max is extremely close in size to the 2013 Moto X. Maybe it will be my future phone.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#675

Post by FollowingTheDao »

DrBenCarson wrote: post #541
FollowingTheDao wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they use much more power when they are receiving data.

Sure. But they also use a massive amount of power when they’re out of range so constantly searching for the network Turning off your modem is second only to turning off your screen if you’re looking to save battery

Not nearly close enough to when they are receiving data, especially video.

When actively receiving data, a cellular modem will use significantly more power than when idle, with the exact amount depending on factors like network strength, data rate, and the specific modem technology, but typically ranging from several hundred milliwatts to a few watts

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#676

Post by bdhcuidbebe »

dima55 wrote: post #531
ndiddy wrote: post #451

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course your phone has a short runtime, it both has a small battery and it's 3 years old so the battery's worn out. One of the main reasons why small phones remain a niche is that improvements in battery technology have been far outpaced by improvements in SoCs, so the easiest way to improve a device's battery life vs. the older model is to make it larger so it can fit a bigger battery. Even when it was new, the re…

If only one could open the back and replace the battery, the thing that has been known to everybody to wear out while the rest of the device is perfectly functional. One could only dream of such advanced technology. Maybe in 10 years.

Lol, indeed! That was a given with the Nokia.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#678

Post by MichaelNolan »

aianus wrote: post #484
dagmx wrote: post #4

Very cool to see a new entry into the modem market. Obviously not available for anyone other than Apple, but I’m interested to see how it shapes up over time much like their SoC has done. This has been a long time coming since Apple bought Intels modem division several years ago. I’m also interested to see if it enables cellular in laptops. Afaik the limiting factor has been that Qualcomm charge a percentage of devic…

Why doesn’t iPhone tethering solve this problem already? Why pay for two modems? Genuinely curious.

I'm probably a small minority, but I would trade my phone in for a clamshell/dumbphone tomorrow if my Macbook had 5g. Separately, tethering seems to blow through my phone battery.

Re: Apple Debuts iPhone 16e

#679

Post by uni_baconcat »

lofaszvanitt wrote: post #121
apgwoz wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sold poorly, sadly.

Of course, since they gimped it. What about creating a smaller version laden with features...

ASUS tried. Zenfone packed flagship camera, display and chip into a compact body, but still sales poorly. So they also gave up last year.
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