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Elon’s Out

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Re: Elon’s Out

#671

Post by DarkmSparks »

philipwhiuk wrote: post #646
DarkmSparks wrote: post #645

Why does it have to be that complicated? Twitter says only 5% of its active users are bots. Anyone who has paid attention to say Joe Bidens follower count[1] would put it closer to 50% [1] https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10829675/Almost-hal... Bloomberg says there is no evidence of this... yeah, personally I dont really see any evidence of twitter having more than 200 or 300 million real users, and only a sm…

The problem is that Twitter distinguishes 'automated account' from 'mininimum wage-farm account'. The later are not bots even though they are not genuine engagement.

Surely the problem is the believability of twitter claiming they have about 50% the number of active users as instagram (250million vs 500million).

When a cursory glance of twitter accounts shows its only a small number of American celebrities and a few global politicians that still use twitter instead of telegram.

The onus is on twitter to prove that 250million number, and Musks lawyers are saying they fell well short of doing so.

A bloomberg hit piece on Musk claiming Musk didnt show it isnt true wont save twitter, and they've been in terminal decline even before they banned Trump.

Re: Elon’s Out

#672

Post by anticensor »

mcguire wrote: post #508
daenz wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't other shareholders sue the government for tanking the stock and essentially "stealing" value from them?

"The government" isn't doing anything here. Elon and Twitter have a contract. Elon wants out; Twitter doesn't want to let him out; the contract only has limited conditions to allow Elon out. The court is simply deciding which of two options is the case: 1. Elon's reasons are valid; he gets out of the contract for a $1B payment. 2. Elon's reasons are not valid; he has to satisfy the contract and pay $54.20/share for T…

#3: Contract is void, performance must be undone at the expense of all parties because unjust enrichment.

Re: Elon’s Out

#673

Post by ckastner »

ratww wrote: post #604
tptacek wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like an enormous amount of risk to take on just to sell stock that he actually owns and avoiding "looking like a hypocrite". It's not just plausible but somewhat likely that he'll be forced into an 11-figure settlement with Twitter to avoid the actual worst case outcome of being forced to take custody of and actually operate Twitter until he can unload it on someone else.

It's not about avoiding looking like a hypocrite, the major theory is that it's about being able to sell 8.5bi without causing the value to go down too much.

Your argument is inconsistent. Why would the value go down at all, if not because he would look like a hypocrite otherwise.

Regardless, even if this were consistent, GP's argument still stands: that's an enormous asking of risk to take on. It could end up costing him more than the $8.5bn.

Re: Elon’s Out

#675

Post by retcon »

tsimionescu wrote: post #628
neither_color wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Tesla's market cap is double of Toyota, VW, Mercedes, BMW, GM, Honda, Ferrari and Volvo all combined! This phrase gets thrown around a lot with dunning-kreuger confidence so I'd like to add context that it's not unusual for a market disruptor to be worth more than the sum of its legacy competitors - you are on a tech website related to startup incubator you should know this already.

That would be the case if they had disrupted some market, but Tesla has only succeeded in creating a new niche vehicle, and cornering that market to some extent. They are still bit players in the overall car market (and they are losing market dominance even in BEVs, mostly to Chinese companies).

Erm, it's VW due to overtake Tesla for EV sales by the end of this year.

Edit: ouch that statement might have been correct if VW hadn't sold out annual production by May and supply chain problems hamper ramp up. So it's predicted for 2024 VW BEV sales will exceed those of Tesla.

Re: Elon’s Out

#676

Post by scaramanga »

Nevermark wrote: post #109
BobbyJo wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In very direct, real terms, assets are power. They represent resources to do things. The problem here isn't that wealth is power, it will always be power. The issue is that a single person has been allowed to accumulate too much.

It would mitigate the problem if institutions could be strengthened by design to be less sensitive to corruption or special treatment. There are lots of successful examples - constitutions, voting, term limits, separate judiciary, non-political commuters, etc The big problem I see in the design of egalitarian systems, is explicitly addressing the need for continuous response to new forms of centralization. I don’t kn…

Nobody "designs" institutions. They are fought for by factions within the societies. The idea that some benevolent hand will come up with a better design is simply an absurd non sequitur. If there is going to be a significant change to the system, one which alters the political landscape, it is going to have to be fought for. And it will have to overcome bitter resistance from all those who benefit from the current order. To suppose otherwise is to engage in a pure flight of fancy.

Re: Elon’s Out

#677

Post by ratww »

ckastner wrote: post #673
ratww wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about avoiding looking like a hypocrite, the major theory is that it's about being able to sell 8.5bi without causing the value to go down too much.

Your argument is inconsistent. Why would the value go down at all, if not because he would look like a hypocrite otherwise. Regardless, even if this were consistent, GP's argument still stands: that's an enormous asking of risk to take on. It could end up costing him more than the $8.5bn.

I’m not making any argument, I’m just repeating the most popular theory right now.

Re: Elon’s Out

#678

Post by scaramanga »

MrMan wrote: post #118
Nevermark wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would mitigate the problem if institutions could be strengthened by design to be less sensitive to corruption or special treatment. There are lots of successful examples - constitutions, voting, term limits, separate judiciary, non-political commuters, etc The big problem I see in the design of egalitarian systems, is explicitly addressing the need for continuous response to new forms of centralization. I don’t kn…

This is a forum for white guys trying to become more powerful, and who hate government or any limits on their actions

You might be interested to read: https://newrepublic.com/article/153046/stark-political-divid...

Re: Elon’s Out

#679

Post by f6v »

victor106 wrote: post #198

Elon’s going to get away with this. Even though he shouldn’t. The rich play by different rules and the law lets them. If the rest of us did the same we would have to pay ridiculous fines and/or spent time behind bars.

It’s not that he’s just rich. He’s involved in double-purpose tech that USA government uses.

Re: Elon’s Out

#680

Post by mattbrewsbytes »

tzury wrote: post #595

Elon Musk apparently has bigger issues that should have been preventing him from playing with the idea of buying twitter, and yet, he went for it, following a tweet that simply went out of control... - Tesla plants challenges worldwide (From China to Berlin via Texas) - Cybertruck ever postponing release date? - SolarCity and the dissmissed promises - Neuralink: Simply read the Wikipedia's entry [1] - Hyperloop (or i…

I think the other thing is in the US he now has some competition and they may just overtake the % of EV’s sold in a few years. People will have choices for EV instead of pick Tesla so he potentially used this buying twitter to sell off a bunch of stock. I wouldn’t be surprised if he finds other reasons to sell off massive amounts of stock in the next 2 years.

My guess is cybertruck will be DOA. Anyone who wants an EV Truck is likely going to order an F-150 Lightning - looks like every other F-150, F-150 is the best selling automobile in the US.

Once other auto makers ramp up production, Tesla cars will continue to be a niche luxury product with some gimmicky features.

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