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Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

nytimes.com

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Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#671

Post by GaryNumanVevo »

listless wrote: post #508

It seems like Parler gives law enforcement an easy way to track these folks and see what they’re planning. Is it really a good idea to send them underground? I’m also reading a lot about how you can’t incite violence. We should all be able to agree on that. What concerns me is that many used Facebook/Twitter over the summer to plan riots, bombing of federal buildings and even seceding from the USA in Seattle. The pro…

Most domestic terrorism leads are surfaced through confidential informants / undercover agents. The number of groups planning / with the capabilities to commit terror are small. The Michigan kidnapping plot was effectively a bunch of guys with almost no skills, they were recruiting an "explosives expert" and it was an easy in for an undercover FBI agent to infiltrate the group.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#672

Post by ralusek »

I don't use Parler, but this is nuts.

AWS, Google, Apple, Twitter are private (sector) businesses, and it's fine for them to do what they want. That being said, there are two issues here.

One, is that even the staunchest free market advocates acknowledge that monopolies are constructs by which markets fail the public, and we designate trust busting as a necessary function of the state. This is yet another action in a series among many that demonstrates that not only are these companies beyond any reasonable threshold of what would historically constitute a monopoly, but that they repeatedly act in collusion with one another in service of specific objectives. These companies have the capability to effectively lock competitors out of even getting their footing. "If a baker can refuse to bake a cake for a gay couple, what's wrong with this?" Well, Twitter is already an effective monopoly in its space, but Parler is created as a miniscule competitor. It has virtually no chance, but it carves out a space for itself. Well Apple and Google remove it from their marketplaces, and the apk is removed from major hosts. So now Parler needs to build its own smartphones, OSes, and marketplaces. Well now AWS says they won't host their servers, so Parler needs to build and maintain their own server infrastructure. What's next, credit cards refuse to process their transactions, banks refuse to serve them? You're okay with this?

Secondly, do we approve of the existing monopolies doing this? Over the last few months, militant leftists have caused an estimated 5 billion in damages, taken over police stations, burned down the Minneapolis police station, attempted to burn down the federal courthouse in Portland, set up two anarchist insurrection zones which resulted in multiple murders and rapes, as well as racially segregated spaces and speaking areas, taken down century old statues of Lincoln and Grant, among others, have beat multiple business owners to within inches of their lives, destroyed countless businesses, many of which have no insurance. But this is where the buck stops? A free speech platform that hosted some of the conversations that led to a single (completely unacceptable) act by a group? I observe a group of radical leftists on Facebook, that, in regards to the storming of the Capitol building, have said "do not question their tactics, just their motives." This is a group on Facebook that doesn't think there's a problem with storming the Capitol or threatening the lives of the Congress, just that they disagree with the motives. That's apparently the case for Facebook as well, as well as the rest of these platforms.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#673

Post by rubyn00bie »

Hell yes.

The people being cut-off are literally outta their minds. Anyone thinking it's unfair is also outta their minds... or thinking it's about censorship. Nah, it's about not-supporting a coup of the USA and murderous assholes.

In the USA, of all places, we don't have to do shit we don't want to do (except pay taxes). No one wants to share anything with fucking Nazis. These insurrectionists are fighting against the very fabric that gives them the things they want.

They have completely disconnected from reality if they expect the benefits of a diverse intellectually rich society, but want that society eradicated, locked up, and enslaved. Do you really think we'd have the fucking internet if the nazis had won? ROFLCOPTR. Fucking ROFLCOPTRs. They're attempting to overthrow the USA's election results-- they're traitors.

I'd even be against using the word "traitor" if they weren't nazi-white-supremacist fuckheads. I'm using it because they're traitors, not just to democracy, but to humanity. They seek the destruction and enslavement of others. This is not a fucking joke. FACT: Hitler was laughed at AND staged a failed coup; which went unpunished (he was having guests and was free to roam the prison) before the camps and WWII. I can't even make this shit up. It's honestly like Trump is reading Hitler's bio for tips on how to get ahead... but back to the point.

If someone wants to murder me, enslave me, deeply believes I am inherently unequal, and that I am not even human; no, I will not help them. Is that strange? I have a pretty strong feeling it's not.

So then no one, fucking no one, should be surprised that the PEOPLE who built AWS, Apple, Google, Facebook, Twitter, reddit et. al do not want to empower those that want to destroy, enslave, and torture them.

To be clear, this could not be less about censorship. If anything, it's a testament to free speech this shit went on for as long as it did. I'd even be more pissed about it going on for as long as it did, but better late than never, if we all weren't balls deep triaging an attempted coup of the USA.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#675

Post by jp57 »

I'm distressed and saddened at how many of the free speech proponents on HN are treating the events of January 6 as if it was just another protest and not an existential threat to the republic.

The president's followers said for weeks that "the storm" was coming Jan 6. Nobody took them seriously. Look what happened. The president and his lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, and other followers incited it. Yes the execution of the insurrection was ham-fisted, and it failed to prevent the electoral count from completing, but that's irrelevant. If the mob had managed to find and destroy the electoral certificates, or if the flex-cuffs guys had captured members of congress, we would be talking about something very different now.

The president has a history of responding to setbacks by doubling down. His followers have now begun talking about returning with arms. Only fools would assume that these threats are idle talk or jokes.

The western liberal value of free speech has never extended to incitement of violence. My assumption is that the leaders of Apple, Google, and Amazon don't want to provide a platform for sedition.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#676

Post by dagmx »

gfodor wrote: post #662

I assume this means literally no other website on AWS is hosting content endorsing violence. Or they plan on policing this in general now. Or they do this kind of thing regularly and I am just unaware. Which is it?

It's most likely the last option.

Enforcing their terms against one client and not another doesn't mean they are greenlighting the other client. It just means they haven't gotten around to it. It's a fallacy to assume otherwise.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#677

Post by spacemanmatt »

gfodor wrote: post #662

I assume this means literally no other website on AWS is hosting content endorsing violence. Or they plan on policing this in general now. Or they do this kind of thing regularly and I am just unaware. Which is it?

It's also entirely AWS' prerogative to decide when, on whom, and how to enforce their TOS. They reserve their rights ahead of time.

Re: Amazon, Apple and Google Cut Off Parler

#678

Post by prontodeveloper »

salimmadjd wrote: post #538

Anyone looked at the three sample complaints? 7 upvotes, 2 upvotes, 5 upvotes. For context, the post (I'm guessing he is a co-founder or some senior person at Parler) John Matze has 34,000 upvotes. These posts seem like bad or manufactured examples. What prevents a competitor from sending a few people to post these things to eliminate competition? Or worse. Who remembers Knew Knowledge faking Russian bots to smear a…

Companies have a right to refuse service to a customer for any reason (the reason doesn't have to be disclosed). Imagine as a startup, being forced to sign a contract (under duress) that you know is not aligned with your long term goals.
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