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Richard M. Stallman resigns

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Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#671

Post by CathedralBorrow »

josteink wrote: post #336
raxxorrax wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your "inclusivity" stops at Stallman, it seriously lacks performance. You use the wrong word. What you desire is conformity. edit: Additionally, because I think this isn't obvious here, Stallman opened up the knowledge about software to the whole world and put energy in keeping it that way. Anyone was able to profit from this.

> You use the wrong word. What you desire is conformity. This seems to be a pretty common paradox. The people who promote "diversity" (and sometimes even diversity of thought!), never accept anyone who wants to debate the nuances of that concept, nor how that may best be implemented. Basically they demand conformity to the one "diverse" view and their definition of diversity. You're either with them or you're "part o…

...and that seems to be a pretty common straw man. Who is "they"? Is this a self-selected group, or chosen by you? Am I maybe in it?

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#673

Post by colechristensen »

hackworks wrote: post #523
marble-drink wrote: post #505

I'm so relieved to find that at least on hacker news people can still evaluate this situation with reason. Out there it's a witch hunt and Stallman is now a witch. RMS is a great man but sadly has difficulties communicating with the wider world. This has been true of many great minds throughout history. It's sad to see it happen to one of my own heroes but I believe history will do him justice if we continue to fight…

Twitter has become a breeding ground for mobs and unjustified moral policing. I started following people based on the technical work they have done and was hoping to learn or get inspired them. Apart from a very few, every accomplished technologist have started using Twitter and their followers to attack others. This is nothing but the witch hunt from medieval times done differently. I have interacted with RMS in Ema…

He was defending his friend who, at the age of 74, is accused of having sex with a 17 year old girl on a billionaire's private island.

Is that unrelated, trivial behavior that should be ignored?

This isn't a witch hunt, what he did was wildly inappropriate and the number of people defending his behavior because he's quirky and did great things is a little disgusting.

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#674

Post by [deleted] »

chimprich wrote: post #483
csb6 wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The wrong opinion? Stallman questions whether the victim, who he admits was coerced into sex, was actually sexually assaulted. This is an incredibly shameful take on the situation. If any politician or public figure said this statement in the past 70 years, they would have ended their career. There are no Internet vigilantes hunting down dissenters. There are people trying to downplay sexual assault. As the internet…

> If any politician or public figure said this statement in the past 70 years, they would have ended their career. "I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star they let you do it. You can do anything. [...] Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything."

[deleted]

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#675

Post by Cacti »

smallmancontrov wrote: post #591
marble-drink wrote: post #505

I'm so relieved to find that at least on hacker news people can still evaluate this situation with reason. Out there it's a witch hunt and Stallman is now a witch. RMS is a great man but sadly has difficulties communicating with the wider world. This has been true of many great minds throughout history. It's sad to see it happen to one of my own heroes but I believe history will do him justice if we continue to fight…

I'm far from certain RMS's only offense was difficulty communicating, but the "evolution" of his statements as they traveled through the media was terrifying to witness. Stallman: > the most plausible scenario is that she presented herself to him as entirely willing. Selam G. > [Stallman] says that an enslaved child could, somehow, be “entirely willing”. VICE: > Stallman insists that the “most plausible scenario” is…

you don’t need to follow the chain, his first comment is bad enough:

> the most plausible scenario is that she presented herself to him as entirely willing.

stop. stop and think about this. you’re telling me that some random person on the internet can sit there and claim, with a straight face, decades removed from the event, and completely unaware of what went down in that room, that “the most plausible scenario” is that she was willing? are you kidding me? how do you know? he wasn’t there. he doesn’t know this person. and why is this so plausible? on what actual basis here is he making this statement? oh, that’s right, nothing except his own prejudices.

he doesn’t know a damned thing about what happened in that room, and for him to jump to the conclusion that, well obviously, she wanted it, is freaking absurd.

he entirely deserves to get pilloried for this statement alone. he had no business jumping into this discussion, he has absolutely no basis on which to make his judgements except his high opinion of himself, and to go out of his way to engage in a public debate about such a highly sensitive subject when he knows jack squat about it shows an incredible lack of judgement.

the media didn’t do this to RMS, he did.

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#676

Post by [deleted] »

proy24 wrote: post #361
kfrzcode wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm hesitant to post anything, anywhere, just because I don't want to offend anyone by expressing an earnest opinion. I think the trend's moving more quickly towards self-censorship than anyone realizes. How can we even quantify that? Those who censor just disappear? What stands out for me is the obvious monoculture we're developing. I miss custom PHPBB boards for every little interest and opinion.

I think what is perceived by a community as right or wrong changes as the composition of the community changes...I mean Trump doesn't self-censor because he reflects the values of his broader base and his base eats up whatever he says....RMS' hugs and kisses, free love, anything goes attitude might have been ok during the hippie era of the 70s and 80s during the formative years of his career but does not reflect the…

[deleted]

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#677

Post by peternicky »

I am lost for words...angry and frustrated that this has happened. There have been dozens of things RMS has said in the past that I disagreed with and at the end of the day, I always had (and still have) the highest amount of respect for that man. He is the definition of "harmless as a fly".

Found the word I was looking for: DISGUSTED.

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#678

Post by sigzero »

Kye wrote: post #592
kstenerud wrote: post #509

It's unfortunate that scarlet letter offences are still alive and well in today's culture. Normally, when someone engages in behavior seen as offensive, the procedure is to pressure the person to apologize and mend his ways, and only get rid of him if he refuses to do so. But when a "scarlet letter" offence is involved, we jump straight to the punishment phase, removing the person outright with no judicial process. T…

>> "Normally, when someone engages in behavior seen as offensive, the procedure is to pressure the person to apologize and mend his ways, and only get rid of him if he refuses to do so." How many years and incidents is enough to move to removal?

People make it sound like Stallman never did offensive or questionable things. This was the veritable "straw".

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#679

Post by colechristensen »

RMS was defending his friend who, at the age of 74, is accused of having sex with a 17 year old girl on a billionaire's private island.

There is not a defense for what RMS was writing or how he was trying to defend Minsky.

The prevalence of comments trying to turn this against "SJW"s or whatever "other" they can because they're a fan of RMS is disturbing.

This isn't us vs. them.

This is a man who said something wildly inappropriate in an MIT forum and got fired. He deserved it. Defending him by pointing towards people who overreact to things is a bit terrible.

The firing was appropriate and reasonable, not a response to extremists, zealots, or some other kind of witch.

I welcome anyone to provide a counter-argument.

Re: Richard M. Stallman resigns

#680

Post by lostjohnny »

anotheryou wrote: post #574
kstenerud wrote: post #509

It's unfortunate that scarlet letter offences are still alive and well in today's culture. Normally, when someone engages in behavior seen as offensive, the procedure is to pressure the person to apologize and mend his ways, and only get rid of him if he refuses to do so. But when a "scarlet letter" offence is involved, we jump straight to the punishment phase, removing the person outright with no judicial process. T…

On the other hand even with this resignation he doesn't appologize for anything. He could even have made his point of thinking it's a misunderstanding and appologize, but didn't.

> but didn't.

So he's being punished for thinking out loud and not apoligising for thinking out loud?

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