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A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

president.mit.edu

661–670 of 756 posts

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#661
post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no shortage of money This is a general theme in the last decade. There is a lot of money, but it is more and more ending up in the pockets of the extremely wealthy. I'm really no communist, but we've reached a point where the system starts to crumble because of it. It also can't be in the interest of the billionaires. They also want to live in a safe country and use working public infrastructure (roads, ai…

Until last year, the share of wealth by the 1% had been basically flat at 31% for a decade https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/WFRBST01134 Your expectations aren't matching reality

I am looking at your link and thinking I took crazy pills.

The graph shows just under 23% in 1989, going up past 27% by 1996, then dipping a few years later only to go up to 29% a bit before 2008, then another dip and rise to almost 32% today.

Am I misreading the graph? If not, the percentage of wealth owned by the 1% is on track to have increased 50% over ~40 years. (23% --> 34.5%)

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#662

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an interpretation, not a fact. And “glorified immigration program” is not a neutral factual label because it implies the educational function is mostly pretextual. I can understand your perspective, but please stop pretending to me that you're simply making factual statements and not a value judgement.

It is pretextual for a lot of foreign students, I don't know how anyone can deny that in good faith. Its definitely not a value judgements because I never said whether it's a good or bad thing on net. Sometimes good things have to be smuggled through a pretext.

"pretextual for a lot of foreign students" means something very different from "these degrees are often glorified immigration programs", which is how you entered the discussion. Can you at least admit that if you're here in good faith?

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#663
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universities get ~40-50% of their funding from the government. Private equity doesn't quite fit.

Is that across all universities? Because I would guess that, for example, University of Illinois gets a much larger portion of its funding from government sources than University of Chicago (which would be one of those well-endowed universities which, incidentally, just cut tuition to zero for undergrads from families making less than $250K).

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Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#664
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universities get ~40-50% of their funding from the government. Private equity doesn't quite fit.

Is that across all universities? Because I would guess that, for example, University of Illinois gets a much larger portion of its funding from government sources than University of Chicago (which would be one of those well-endowed universities which, incidentally, just cut tuition to zero for undergrads from families making less than $250K).

This study estimates that government spending is 40% of public university revenue, ~10% for private schools. https://nces.ed.gov/programs/coe/indicator/cud/postsecondary...

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#665
post #584

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not true. Billionaires rely on public safety. To fly their private jets around the world they need ATC and airports. They need police, so angry people don't buy rockets and shoot their planes down. They also want to chill at their pool, without hundreds of people outside rioting. They want to drive their sports cars somewhere. They don't want to live their life in a zombie apocalypse shelter. And how good wil…

No, what you are describing are billionaires using public money to subsidize their lifestyles.

The idea is that everyone pays taxes. Those things are paid by tax money.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is pretextual for a lot of foreign students, I don't know how anyone can deny that in good faith. Its definitely not a value judgements because I never said whether it's a good or bad thing on net. Sometimes good things have to be smuggled through a pretext.

"pretextual for a lot of foreign students" means something very different from "these degrees are often glorified immigration programs", which is how you entered the discussion. Can you at least admit that if you're here in good faith?

Yes I'll admit that these statements imply different things. But I maintain that advanced degrees at American universities are functionally an immigration program and that this is unspoken yet by design

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about research, science research in particular. "Preparing for the workforce" is not the point here (and arguably should not really be the point of education in general, but much can be said about that...). You speak of "market" and "cost-value" and economic darwinism. You seem to be confused: many things do not work based on next-quarter revenue optimisation, fundamental science research being one of them.

> This is about research, science research in particular. "Preparing for the workforce" is not the point here (and arguably should not really be the point of education in general, but much can be said about that...). This is a bit short sighted. Not all university studies are for fundamental science (law, for instance). Some university studies need to work together with industry (again, law. or some physics studies).…

Ok, but that's not at all what this article is about.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that what the article is saying? Less research funding == Fewer admissions. > The number of graduate student admissions is directly tied to the amount of external funding. Minor quibble: It's not merely external funding. In many sciences (math, physics, chemistry), it's common for the department to promise funding through non-research means for a number of years. In my top school, I think physics students were…

While it is true that departments often fund their graduate students for the first year (or possibly 2) out of their own budgets, their budgets are largely determined by the generosity of their Deans (who got the money from indirect costs from grants) or their own indirect costs. And they will not be admitting students if they do not see a clear path for them to be externally funded after their first year or two.

Oh yes. As I said, the math department guaranteed 6 years. If they can't guarantee it, they won't admit the student.

The engineering departments, however, admitted students regardless of funding as long as they met the bar. On the application they'd ask the candidate if they wanted the admission to be contingent on funding.

Universities like MIT that admit only if they have funding for engineering are the outliers. Usually they're private universities.

Re: A message from President Kornbluth about funding and the talent pipeline

#670

Academia is about to go through a generational reset. The system is broken and the market only tolerates broken systems for so long. There are a ton of great things that come out of universities but it’s also clear that a model of charging folks well into the six-figures for a useless degree that doesn’t prepare them for the workforce is dead and a reckoning is underway. Many schools will fail and shut down. Of those…

It's simple. The US used to be the most desirable place for immigrants and the US higher education system used to be the envy of the world and now for both of these it is not any more. A reset was always inevitable.

We used to build great big crazy things too, lots via research universities due to vast federal and defense research.

That has changed. It should be reinstated. Cut red tape, get back into the business of taking (literal) moonshots as a government.

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