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Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

economist.com

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Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#661

Post by kayodelycaon »

rootusrootus wrote: post #255
JustARandomGuy wrote: post #3

Millennial: same feeling here. When I talk to people of my parents generation they always talk about how cars let them roam about and give them freedom. I never felt the same way, and I think a large part of that is that I grew up with the Internet; I could always AOL Instant Messenger (AIM) my friends or use ICQ. I was always connected even during an era of dialup. With the always-on functionality of modern phones,…

This is very obvious when dealing with young people today. When I was growing up, we came home from school, dropped off our bags, and then I didn't see the inside of my house until dinner time. Everything was outside, all the time. Even with the advent of the Nintendo, we still spent the vast majority of play time outside. But then the Internet become a thing. For some of us sooner rather than later (I started earlie…

I think there's a little more to this. I'm in my thirties and grew up in a lower-middle class suburb. Once I was in middle school, I didn't leave the house unless I was forcibly pushed out. All of the land around me had been sold and built on. Most of the owners didn't want other people's kids in their yard. The nearest park was several miles away and I wasn't allowed to go alone. My nearest friend was six miles away in the opposite direction.

Going outside the house was boring because all of the fun things I wanted to were too far away or off limits.

I knew a lot of people through my parent's church. This seemed to be a pretty common experience.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#662

Post by revscat »

BizarreByte wrote: post #517
revscat wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now add the cost of gas/petrol. For the average American that’s $3000/year. > more reliable So what? They are still a cost that is forced upon us. I don’t want a car. Yet I have to have one whether I like it or not.

You can move somewhere you don't require a car. If you're posting on HN that is likely well within your ability. Gas does cost a decent amount, but it's also something you can control. Combine trips, drive less, and drive more tamely. In my opinion the freedom and convenience of a car is worth the cost of fuel.

How about you move, jerk? Why the hell should I have to move because of forced auto ownership?

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#663

Post by spacemadness »

mellosouls wrote: post #563
spacemadness wrote: post #523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, talking about adding bike lanes in cities and improving public transportation should really infuriate the rural demographic that continually think everything is about them and their way of life. These ideas must all come from the cult of anti-car that wants to come into every tiny city and change everything overnight apparently. It’s typical status quo paranoia that always tries to halt any progress in these are…

the rural demographic that continually think everything is about them and their way of life Rubbish, these articles are nearly always written by and supported by the dominant voice in the mainstream media - young, liberal city-dwellers, who seem to have no concept that there is a huge part of the population who are funding their "progress", often at the expense of their own infrastructure and quality of life.

I mean, sure, that is in fact the ridiculously paranoid narrative that keeps that argument afloat. Those damn city slickers.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#664

Post by Xylakant »

ryukafalz wrote: post #538
secretsatan wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't owned a car for at least 15 years since I moved to Switzerland, don't miss it at all. I do occasionally need a car, so I'm a member of a car sharing scheme, they always have cars nearby, I pay a low yearly feee and a low rate per time and kms used, easy to book with an app, probably cost me the same for a year as a parking space for a month. For an occasional weekend away I might get a car from a regular hi…

>I do occasionally need a car, so I'm a member of a car sharing scheme, they always have cars nearby This is something I wish were more common in the US. I'm in a relatively high-density suburb of one of the largest US cities and they're practically nonexistent here, and even in the city are hard to come by.

The economics don’t work out in places where almost everyone has a car. And in places where other options are scarce, everyone owns a car. (Works the same for public transit)

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#665

Post by Haga »

overthemoon wrote: post #174

I'm an aging millennial, but on a purely personal level, when I lived in a city with good public transit, I was a lot happier, most of the time. I really like stepping off the train and the bus and being on my own two feet, the walking exercise, not being chained to this thing I have to worry about. I hate driving, I hate parking, I hate owning a car--the maintenance, the ongoing cost of fuel and insurance, all of it…

[dead]

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#666

Post by UtopiaPunk »

taylodl wrote: post #287

The young are falling out of love with cars because they're unaffordable. It's as simple as that. It's yet another sign the standard of living is declining for the young. The average new car price in the U.S. is now over $47K (Consumer Reports). I make a good living and I'm not going to pay that kind of money for a new car! A young person would be stupid to pay that kind of money for a car. Okay, so what about used c…

It's not just that they are unaffordable. My wife and I have two cars between us and live in the suburbs. We're concerned about climate change and trying to find ways to contribute to the problem less, so we try to drive less.

In doing that, though, I've discovered that cars are kind of miserable! Walking, biking, and riding the train are all much more pleasant ways of getting from one place to another. I feel more engaged with the world around me and more active. I also have a little kid and feel much more concerned these days about car crashes (with cars, but especially with pedestrians).

So with all that, we're trying to form a plan to move to a larger city that prioritizes other forms of transit over cars. It'll be more expensive. Although maybe it'll all even out if we stop driving?

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#667

Post by lotsofpulp »

fwungy wrote: post #651
lotsofpulp wrote: post #606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Write it off what?

If the car is purchased for a business you can write off the depreciation.

I do not see how that is applicable in a discussion about young people at large being able to afford cars for personal use.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#668

Post by nradov »

sagarm wrote: post #570
nradov wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love my car. Not only is it faster and more convenient than public transport, it is highly reliable and not subject to union strikes. All of the maintenance is quick and cheap. There are multiple fuel stations nearby. Traffic jams do suck, but adaptive cruise control makes them suck a lot less.

> traffic jams do suck Or put more succinctly, you agree cars suck. Some of us just go one car further.

I don't agree at all. Cars are awesome! Reliable, fast personal mobility is a huge step forward in quality of life.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#669

Post by mgkimsal »

taylodl wrote: post #657
yonaguska wrote: post #536

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, once I started cycling, public transportation became a painful exercise in constraint. I would even prefer to cycle through freezing temperatures on icy roads rather than cram myself into a train or on a bus. Luckily for me, the bike ride was a 20 minute commute for most of my 20s, while the bus/train would be 40 minutes, and a care would also be about 30-40 minutes with traffic. True freedom for me is the motor…

Motorcycling is also significantly cheaper than is owning a car. The average used car price in the US buys a top-of-the-line, brand-new motorcycle. Used (and even new) motorcycles can be had for significantly cheaper. The insurance and fuel costs are significantly less as well. A motorcyclist will have half the cost or even much less than that of a car owner. I know people always respond that motorcycling is more dan…

I would probably still use a car for many things, but am somewhat open to the idea of a motorcycle, but I HATE the noise. An electric seems like it would resolve that concern, no?

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#670

Post by somethingreen »

benjaminwootton wrote: post #20

The young are falling out of love with home ownership, cars, dating, drinking etc. I suspect a lack of money is the common factor.

It's probably this. Best things about cars are luxury, not strictly utility.

Having to own a car and drive it everywhere every day can be pretty miserable. Being able to afford owning a car and not having to drive it all the time is wonderful. Freedom of having an option to just go anywhere at any time is not something I ever thought I would appreciate so much before I had to get a car for security reasons. But it absolutely is a luxury as even mediocre public or commercial services will get you 90% of own car utility. And good public or commercial services can eliminate whole categories of car use cases.

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