Live data from Hacker News

Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

ifixit.org

661–670 of 927 posts

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#661
The horrible user experience that is the Mac Keyboard is so upsetting to me (granted, I'm a keyboard snob).

The original Apple ][ keyboard was one of the best I'd ever used. The original 1984 Mac keyboard was great. The kb's in the last few years (the Jony Ive era?) have been so unsatisfying. They work, mostly, but are hardly joyful.

I guess when Jony makes his solid chunk of depleted uranium that doesn't actually do anything, he'll be satisfied.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#662

I am a huge fan of Apple's products and never understood the fuss when the new Pro Keyboard attracted bad press, reading it on my old, robust pre-2015 era Macbook. Until now. I got the new one at my job three months back. And, here I am, still struggling with and super annoyed with the missed keystrokes (the buttons are so thin/don't press properly), the almost non-existent 'Enter' keys (seriously, who messes with th…

In addition to all of these valid complaints, it's also loud!

It's louder than their past keyboards but it's not loud. Compare it to a mechanical keyboard.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#663

I am a huge fan of Apple's products and never understood the fuss when the new Pro Keyboard attracted bad press, reading it on my old, robust pre-2015 era Macbook. Until now. I got the new one at my job three months back. And, here I am, still struggling with and super annoyed with the missed keystrokes (the buttons are so thin/don't press properly), the almost non-existent 'Enter' keys (seriously, who messes with th…

I have the same issue with missed keystrokes. I estimate at least 5% of what I type has to be fixed.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#664

Apple. This issue is seriously simple. Take the previous design, you know the one from late 2012 to 2015. If you must (sigh), take out the SD card, HDMI, USB A, MagSafe and replace with USB-C. I don't know who suggested this, but whatever. Don't add in a touch bar. Don't add in an over sized touchpad. Leave the keyboard alone. The layout of the model is amazing. I purchased a late 2012 in Jan '13. It's been my daily…

> The layout of the model is amazing.

Compared to what's out now, yeah, it's great. But in absolute terms, it's only moderately functional.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#665
post #574
post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d cut Apple some slack on the RAM front because Intel was supposed to ship DDR4LP a couple years ago, after years of being fairly good about hitting targets. The larger point about recognizing that we’ve plateaued on size & weight benefits is important, though. As long as we need keyboards there’s not much point in taking on all of the other compromises.

Ironically, it was Steve Jobs' pep talk to new executives that went something like: "The difference between a janitor and executive is that VPs are not allowed to have excuses". So trying to share the blame with Intel is just silly. Every single Apple's competitor delivers laptops with 32+ GB of RAM, and MacBooks are stuck at 16GB and there's no one to blame for it but Apple.

> Every single Apple's competitor delivers laptops with 32+ GB of RAM, and MacBooks are stuck at 16GB and there's no one to blame for it but Apple.

This is only partially correct: those are separate models which are bigger and have worse power and heat characteristics. Every laptop which is similar to Apple's shares the 16GB limit for the same reason; the difference is that Apple has decided not to offer that second tier.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#666

I am typing this on an early 2013 MacBook Pro and I dread the possibility that it will die before Apple decides to build a better machine.

I've got a 2012 MBP which doesn't have much in the specs department, so it never gets used. I use my early 2015 MBP from work for my work and personal stuff, I check MacRumours regularly praying that Apple will have come to their senses and make a proper MBP again. When I leave this job I'll have the choice between using my 2012 MBP or buying a 2015 model off of eBay, it's a sad state of affairs, and every power user…

The other thing is that they really haven't provided a compelling reason to upgrade. Sure, I would like a faster CPU with more cores. But what I really need is more RAM and they don't offer that. My 2013 MacBook Pro has 16GB, just like the 2018 MacBook Pro. I would love to buy a model just like this with more RAM and an integrated LTE modem. A faster CPU would be gravy. I would even be willing to put up with no longer having a real escape key.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#668
post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion Apple has a very mixed track record when it comes to "jumping the gun." Some things they did exactly when needed (removing the CD drive, Retina displays, ...can't think of any others right now). Other things they did way too early (butterfly keycaps, trackpad size, touch bar, USB C, removing the headphone jack on iPhone).

I think adopting USB-C is fine, but going USB-C only was too early.

Still a dongle on every desk of my office, how many years has this thing been USB-C only now...

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#669

Apple biggest UX failures always stem from putting form before function. There is a lower limit to thinness/lightness before consumers just don't care, and it was passed long ago. There was great progress made with the unibody Macbook Pros and the Macbook Airs but these latest models are so thin that it's actually annoying and leads to issues like poor battery life, lack of repair-ability, and malfunctioning keyboard…

In my opinion Apple has a very mixed track record when it comes to "jumping the gun." Some things they did exactly when needed (removing the CD drive, Retina displays, ...can't think of any others right now). Other things they did way too early (butterfly keycaps, trackpad size, touch bar, USB C, removing the headphone jack on iPhone).

Touchbar should never have happened in the first place, not now, not ever. It such an obviously bad idea.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#670
post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion Apple has a very mixed track record when it comes to "jumping the gun." Some things they did exactly when needed (removing the CD drive, Retina displays, ...can't think of any others right now). Other things they did way too early (butterfly keycaps, trackpad size, touch bar, USB C, removing the headphone jack on iPhone).

I think adopting USB-C is fine, but going USB-C only was too early.

I'm a big fan of USB-C—I try to avoid purchasing any devices without it. But I use the non-USB-C ports on my ThinkPad T480—HDMI, USB-A, Ethernet—on a regular basis. It also has a hot-swappable battery, superb typing experience, and is easily serviced.

And it weighs about the same as a MBP (right in between the 13" and 15" MBP, which makes sense since it's a 14" laptop).

Post reply on HN