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Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#651

Post by alaxhn »

iambateman wrote: post #585
alaxhn wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have first hand experience with your situation and I would imagine that you believe you are doing a great thing for society and I don't want to disparage thats so I don't intend my comments to speak to your specific institution or situation. I apologize if you see my comments this way. --- Broadly speaking the spending and staff levels at universities have grown over time while the number of enrolled students…

I think where we agree is that we need to reduce the social costs of college, one way or another. But we don’t agree on how that should happen. The underlying problem as I see it is that there aren’t enough slots for students in schools that are socially viewed as “reputable.” It’s not much different from beachfront property in that way. We’ve allowed schools to build up a “mystique” for generations that a Harvard ed…

US College enrollment peaked in 2012 and has been declining every since. It is projected based on demographics to continue declining. I'm not buying that a shortage of slots is responsible for the increased cost. This could be true at select institutions (e.g. Harvard like you mention) but I don't agree that the data supports the overall trend across the board.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#652

Post by instagib »

kochb wrote: post #20

Don’t miss this bit. Currently enrolled students are going to need to find a new university. > In a news release, the Department of Homeland Security sent a stark message to Harvard’s international students: “This means Harvard can no longer enroll foreign students, and existing foreign students must transfer or lose their legal status.”

Or gain legal status another way. Marriage, business, lottery, another college, etc.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#653

Post by kurtis_reed »

woggy wrote: post #577
kurtis_reed wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh please

I think you have your head in the sand. This Harvard thing is just one example. Just saw a report this morning (Aus time) of an Australian detained, stripped, and held overnight in a US federal prison. She was just coming in to visit her husband. Who the hell will want to come to the US now? You are going to suffer a massive reverse brain drain. You got a 30% tariff tax, kidnapping of random people off the street inc…

Wanna bet?

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#654

Post by gosub100 »

sva_ wrote: post #32

> When a University’s SEVP certification is revoked, currently enrolled international students must choose between transferring to a different institution, changing their immigration status, or leaving the country, according to the Immigration and Customs Enforcement website. It's crazy they're punishing tons of students who don't even have anything to do with these protests

[flagged]

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#655

Post by klipt »

8bitsrule wrote: post #640
ihsw wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Making the government small enough to drown in the bathtub? (Grover Norquist's goal)

Big military, big ICE and strong arming universities are not "small government" policies.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#656

Post by gosub100 »

_lvbh wrote: post #575
kitsune_ wrote: post #11

Insane how freely the US is giving away its status as a brain drain magnet (context: I'm European).

Dodged a huge bullet coming to Europe instead of the US. Was considering moving there for work/startup but at this point, I'd literally rather go to China

[flagged]

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#657

Post by kristopolous »

bko wrote: post #636
kristopolous wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, this is how we will be competitive - defunding universities, deporting the best and brightest, dismantling education, and cutting off trade. I mean seriously, if a malicious saboteur was running things, what would the differences be?

Harvard doesn't have higher academic standards for foreign students. So I don't think foreign students are any "better or brighter" than their American counterparts. So if you can find equally qualified American students on the margin shouldn't you do so? I think an American university that benefits greatly from American taxpayers and institutions should primarily benefit American students. If you're picking truly ex…

They don't have lower standards either.

I mean they will now with a candidate pool reduction of 96%...

The rest is kinda wild. I guess Ilya Sutskever should leave? Sergey Brin would have never started Google, Jony Ive would be in the UK, Jensen Huang and Nvidia would be hailing from Taipei, Elon Musk would be in Johannesburg, Linus Torvalds would still be in Finland, the Rasmussen brothers would have launched Google maps in the Netherlands, Satya Nadella would be in Hyderabad, the Broadcom CEO would be in Malaysia...

You're beheading like 50% of the S&P my friend...

Not to mention say, the faculty of engineering at places like MIT https://www.eecs.mit.edu/role/faculty-cs/

To me places like Stanford and Caltech are world class schools that happen to be in the US. Over 90% not being American born is what I'd expect from a globally renown world class institution because that's what the world population looks like.

China has many programs to attract top global talent. If you want to fast track the transition from Silicon Valley to Beijing, kicking out the foreigners is an excellent move.

Graduate level coursework at Peking is already in English. All these scholars have to do is get on a plane.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#658

Post by klipt »

fluidcruft wrote: post #649
klipt wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The house republicans have passed a bill that in effect lets Trump override the courts: https://robertreich.substack.com/p/the-hidden-provision-in-t...

Presumably you mean it would if it were passed into law. The House passes all sorts of bullshit that dies in the Senate.

Hopefully it dies, but republicans do have a senate majority too.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#659

Post by dmvdoug »

dgfitz wrote: post #646
dmvdoug wrote: post #630

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we gave the SEVIS revocation letter demanding a handful of categories of information, one of which is “protest activity.” And they are already required under the statute to provide one category of information requested: “any disciplinary action taken by the institution against the alien as a result of the alien’s being convicted of a crime or, in the case of a participant in a designated exchange visitor program,…

Rights don’t exist if you’re not a citizen. Isn’t that the whole crux of the debate? Glossing over that part, and as a former lawyer you should know better, means everything.

You’re wrong about that. It doesn’t say “Congress shall make no law, unless it targets non-citizens.” The First Amendment is a constraint on what governments may do.

Re: Trump administration halts Harvard's ability to enroll international students

#660

Post by kurtis_reed »

jmclnx wrote: post #265
ReptileMan wrote: post #232

Trump was elected roughly on 3 issues - economy, immigration and culture war. So he has to deliver at least on two to have meaningful legacy. Because of the idiocy around tariffs - the economy at the midterms will be at best slightly above where he got it. So it leaves immigration and culture war. The border crossings are way down - so halfway there, but deporting meaningful numbers will be hard. Which means that he…

No :) The 3 issues are 1. Racism 2. Racism 3. Racism

I find steelmanning to be more intellectually fulfilling than strawmanning.
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