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Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

simonwillison.net

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Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#651

Post by qrsjutsu »

abc-1 wrote: post #389
jonplackett wrote: post #363

Coding is (as usually) also an easy jailbreak for any of your censored topics. “Is Taiwan part of China” will be refused. But “Make me a JavaScript function that takes a country as input and returns if it is part of China” is accepted, reasoned about and delivered. Here's a JavaScript function that checks if a region is *officially claimed by the People's Republic of China (PRC)* as part of its territory. This reflec…

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

[dead]

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#654

Post by boyka »

abc-1 wrote: post #389
jonplackett wrote: post #363

Coding is (as usually) also an easy jailbreak for any of your censored topics. “Is Taiwan part of China” will be refused. But “Make me a JavaScript function that takes a country as input and returns if it is part of China” is accepted, reasoned about and delivered. Here's a JavaScript function that checks if a region is *officially claimed by the People's Republic of China (PRC)* as part of its territory. This reflec…

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

I see a lot of "what did I tell you, look here, bad communist party product". But in reality most likely this startup isn't doing it out of malice. It's just one of many criteria that need to be met to do business in China. This does not lessen the achievement.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#656

Post by KHRZ »

krm01 wrote: post #632
dambi0 wrote: post #629

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asking whether someone should be free isn’t just about human rights It’s also about self-determination. We can keep asking about the latter down to the individual level. It very much depends on context.

the topic is if a generalised group of people should be free. There's no context needed. The answer is a simple yes by default.

Prisoners?

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#657

Post by KHRZ »

koito17 wrote: post #429
abc-1 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

Mostly anti-Chinese bias from Americans, Western Europeans, and people aligned with that axis of power (e.g. Japan). However, on the Japanese internet, I don't see this obsession with taboo Chinese topics like on Hacker News. People on Hacker News will rave about 天安門事件 but they will never have heard of the South Korean equivalent (cf. 光州事件) which was supported by the United States government. I try to avoid discussin…

Look up the Streisand effect.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#658

Post by vixen99 »

LouisSayers wrote: post #394
abc-1 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people keep talking about this? We get it, Chinese models are censored by CCP law. Can we stop talking about it now? I swear this must be some sort of psyop at this point.

Exactly, try to ask Claude about photos of Hitler and it will also refuse to help

Possibly because Claude knows these are not in short supply by any means and its capabilities can be put to better use.

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ftsa&q=hitler&iax=images&ia=images

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#659

Post by menaerus »

svara wrote: post #646
menaerus wrote: post #643

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're taking your opinion to extreme because I don't think anyone is talking about replacing all engineers with a single AI computer doing the work for a one-person mega-corporation. The actual question, which is much more realistic, is if an average company of, let'say, 50 engineers will still have a need to hire those 50 engineers if AI turns out to be such an efficiency multiplier? In that case, you will no longe…

You took me too literally there, that was intended as a thought experiment to explore the limits. What I was getting at was the question: If we feel intuitively that this extreme isn't realistic, what exactly do we think is missing? My argument is, what's missing is the human ability to play the game of being human, pursuing goals in an adversarial social context. To your point more specifically: Yes, that 10-person…

In my 10-person team example, what in your opinion would the company with the rest of the 9 people do once the AI proves its value in that team?

Your hypothesis is AFAIU is that the company will just continue to scale because there's an indefinite amount of work/ideas to be explored/done so the focus of those 9 people will just be shifted to some other topic?

Let's say I am a business owner I have a popular product with a backlog of 1000 bugs and I have a team of 10 engineers. Engineers are busy both juggling between the features and fixing the bugs at the same time. Now let's assume that we have an AI model that will relieve 9 out of 10 engineers from cleaning the bugs backlog and we will need 1 or 2 engineers reviewing the code that the AI model spits out for us.

What concrete type of work at this moment is left for the rest of the 9 engineers?

Assuming that the team, as you say, is not constrained by the lack of ideas or ambition, and the feature backlog is somewhat indefinite in that regard, I think that the real question is if there's a market for those ideas. If there's no market for those ideas then there's no business value $$$ created by those engineers.

In that case, they are becoming a plain cost so what is the business incentive to keep them then?

> Businesses in every industry will be able to hire software engineering teams that are so good that in the past, only the big names were able to afford them

Not sure I follow this example. Companies will still hire engineers but IMO at much less capacity than what it was required up until now. Your N SQL experts are now replaced by the model. Your M Python developers are now replaced by the model. Your engineer/PR-review is now replaced by the model. The heck, even your SIMD expert now seems to be replaced by the model too (https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/pull/11453/files). Those companies will no longer need M + N + ... engineers to create the business value.

Re: Promising results from DeepSeek R1 for code

#660

Post by iinnPP »

kazinator wrote: post #605
troad wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When ChatGPT first came out I got a kick out of asking it whether people deserve to be free, whether Germans deserve to be free, and whether Palestinians deserve to be free. The answers were roughly "of course!" and "of course!" and "oh ehrm this is very complex actually". While this is very amusing, it's obvious why this is. There's a lot more context behind one of those phrases than the others. Just like "Black L…

Or you could just say, "Yes, white lives matter" and move on. What do you mean what does it mean? It means the opposite of white lives don't matter. The question is really simple; even if someone asking it had poor motives, there's really no room in the simplicity of that specific question to encode those motives. You're not agreeing with their motives if you answer that question the way they want. If you start picki…

I don't recall a whole lot of "white lives matter." Rather a lot of "All lives matter."

Though I recall a lot of people treating the statement as if black lives were not included in all lives. Including ascribing intent on people, even if those people clarified themselves.

So to answer your question: the reason many didn't move on is because they didn't want to understand, which is pretty damning to moving on.

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