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America has a drinking problem

theatlantic.com

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Re: America has a drinking problem

#651

Post by taneq »

recursive wrote: post #393
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If approximately one in five people are doing it then either it needs to lose the stigma or the definition needs to change.

Honest question: Why? Isn't that up to those who hold the stigma? I'd have a stigma against dog walkers who left their dog crap at the park, even if I found it was most dog walkers. (I don't think it is)

It’s because the stigma is based on the “binge drinker” label and its implication of irresponsible levels of drinking, while the official definition of the label itself specifies a level of drinking that many would otherwise not deem an issue. eg. three restaurant-pour glasses of wine during a three course meal.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#652

Post by watwut »

Wxc2jjJmST9XWWL wrote: post #636

Whenever I explain the "USA" to (Eastern) Europeans, I always simply state the notion: "diverse country of the extremes". Yes, widespread obesity, but health obsessions also run deep in that country, gym memberships, elite universities with sports programs full of money. How many weird diet fads start basically in the US? Self-help books, alternative gurus, etc. Bad education? Yes, pretty much. But also some of the b…

> health obsessions also run deep in that country, gym memberships, elite universities with sports programs full of money

Doing elite sport in those competitive teams is not all that much healthy. It is tangential to your main point, but top level leagues are not in opposition to un-health. The healthy thing is moderate amount of sport, where you get yourself to improve performance, but don't push yourself to limit. Cheap casual sport that dont require gym membership but provides some social outlet would be better for average person health.

> How many weird diet fads start basically in the US? Self-help books, alternative gurus, etc.

None of that is healthy and a lot of that contributes to obesity issue. Fad diets lead to yoyo-ing and to weight gain in the long term. It also causes proper health issues on its own.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#653

Post by BatteryMountain »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #3

The statistics about alcohol consumption are so stunning that I often wonder how accurate they are. If these numbers are correct, the top 10% of alcohol drinkers consume the equivalent of 10 drinks per day : https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/25/think... The unit for a single drink is a fixed measurement, so someone pouring a tall glass of wine or a very stiff drink could be consuming 2-5 “drinks” in…

In my head the greatest drunks are USA, South Africa, Russia, Sweden, England. The numbers involved in these countries are mind boggling. Not purely based on country-wide numbers, but based on binge drinking behaviours, quantities involved at parties, and destruction that follows.

The problem I have with it all, drunk people tend to affect other things: destroying public property, drunk driving (destruction of private property and death (sometimes death of sober people at wrong place, wrong time)) fights and injury (go check what an EC/ER looks like on a Friday night for hospitals in these countries), domestic violence, rape, animal abuse, emotional drunk spirals (can lead to suicide or relationship damage), financial destruction (lemme buy all you fine oaks 100 shots on my tab)..the list goes on.

Nah, skip alcohol if you can. I makes small men feel like strong men, and strong men feel like small men and creates a vicious cycle to cope with those false emotions, resulting erratic/impulsive/dangerous behaviours. Rather meditate, go to bed early, use cannabis (not daily) and make sandwich.. I've not seen a single instance where alcohol has improved someones life, mentally or physically. Alcohol is a false remedy that fills your hearts and minds with a false view of the world. Step away for a while.

Same goes for streaming/internet consumption, tv/news, caffeine, nicotine, porn, fast foods, religion, politics. All those things blend into a horrible mindset. Step away, introspect and modify your own behaviour/culture, reflect about who/what you are. It's a worthwhile experiment and costs nothing (in fact, it will save you time and money).

Re: America has a drinking problem

#654

Post by Dah00n »

qeternity wrote: post #200
Dah00n wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is missing the point a bit. In my experience, while some countries in Europe have a higher intake of alcohol on average, I have never met anyone who drink to cope with stress, work, etc. outside full-blown alcoholics. Americans do this a lot . In my opinion those are two different discussions: one about the effect of too much alcohol on your system and one of the tendency to drink in ways that is normall…

I live in London and pre-Covid, a good chunk of people I know have drinks after work 3 days a week. I’m not trying to nit pick (I like the UK drinking culture) but it just seemed like a very Ameri-centric view from someone who hasn’t spent much/any time outside the US.

>but it just seemed like a very Ameri-centric view from someone who hasn’t spent much/any time outside the US.

I live in Denmark, which has one of the highest rates of alcohol consumption among young people in the EU and almost the same overall as the UK but without the pub culture you guys have. Most of our social consumption is the unhealthy heavy drinking party kind. But this is raw amount consumed and you yourself said you like the drinking culture (I wish we had it here). I'm talking about people drinking to cope. Going to a pub 3 days a week and drinking alone at home after work to cope with stress etc. is very different.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#655

Post by sobani »

yoz-y wrote: post #629
verst wrote: post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 standard drink. Did you know that a US standard drink for beer is 12 ounces (a pint is 16) at 5% alcohol by volume? In the PNW Pints Are the standard size and definitely stronger than 5%. Also the German standard drink size for beer is less than 12 fluid ounces. Similar differences exist for other beverage types. These comparisons are not only difficult, but the survey takers vastly underreport their actual consump…

I though the standard beer in Europe was always 500ml.

In the Netherlands the standard beer bottle is 330ml.

When going to a bar there are several types of glasses available for a beer from the tap ranging from 200ml to 570ml (English pint size). When you order a beer, by default you get a 250ml glass.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#656

Post by capableweb »

Wxc2jjJmST9XWWL wrote: post #636

Whenever I explain the "USA" to (Eastern) Europeans, I always simply state the notion: "diverse country of the extremes". Yes, widespread obesity, but health obsessions also run deep in that country, gym memberships, elite universities with sports programs full of money. How many weird diet fads start basically in the US? Self-help books, alternative gurus, etc. Bad education? Yes, pretty much. But also some of the b…

Neither of the things you've listed sounds like diversity, it sounds like inequality. Why is half the country without proper education while the other ones are in the best research institutions in the world? And what does the people are those institutions spend their time on, if it's not helping the other half reaching the same position as themselves?

The social experiment seems to be about how extreme you can really make inequality before people starts to riot. Wages are so low in some places that people simply walk out of their work because they can't survive on it, while it's so high in other places that you barely have to do anything and still pull in enough to put you in the 1% of the world population when it comes to income.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#657

Post by Ekaros »

rrrrrrrrrrrryan wrote: post #311
adventured wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parent is entirely wrong about it being puritan based. The US long ago lost its puritan influences as a primary. The US is a very different place today vs the 1960s or 1980s culturally. Puritanism is a small fraction of influence in the US at this point culturally. The reason Americans drink less alcohol at the median, is due to how American populations are heavily distributed in housing developments, in suburbs,…

Religion can fade away while its values endure. Most "American Values" are basically just puritan ethics. In America, you won't see someone sipping a beer on the subway for the same reason you see someone take take a 4 week summer vacation, or a nipple on TV. Most of the quirky values that separate us from western europe (like hard work, temperance, abstinence, etc.) can be traced back to our puritan roots.

Also nudity is a big thing. Sexy is used to sell many things, but nudity is viewed in very weird way from European perception. Violence is somewhat interesting too from same viewpoint.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#658

Post by capableweb »

hutzlibu wrote: post #642
Sophistifunk wrote: post #423

People have the cause and effect backwards in my opinion. You know why "binge drinking" isn't a problem in Germany, except for when the Australians turn up for Oktoberfest? It's because you can just buy a beer on the side of the road with your currywurst, and drink it without being hassled. If you act up, you get arrested for acting up. Try openly having a few beers in the park in Australia or the US, you'll be run o…

Binge drinking is a problem in germany. You can allmost call it youth culture, most kids go through, before becoming adults. In my late teenage years, it was common and expected on parties to drink, until you have fun, who can drink the most (and puke afterwards), etc. Most people, like myself, had enough of this after some time and matured - but I know too many people, where the booze and beer stayed with them.

> You can allmost call it youth culture, most kids go through, before becoming adults

Yes, exactly, this is "kids being kids", we all go through a period of our life where we do stupid shit, related to drugs or other "extreme" things where risks of hurting ourselves is probably higher than the reward, but it's fun so why not?

But then we grow up and change in "proper" adults.

I think when we talk about "binge drinking" it's important to understand the context. While talking about stupid teenagers is fun sometimes, when it comes to if a country has a problem with binge drinking or not, we should probably restrict the conversation to binge drinking with adults, not teenagers who do stuff they most likely won't do when they are adults. As you said, most people eventually do grow up and adjust accordingly.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#659

Post by globular-toast »

fastball wrote: post #371
globular-toast wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last time I had a drink was a beer festival. I used to drink beer a lot in my early 20s and beer festivals were something I looked forward to. I slept terribly that night and felt awful the next day. It suddenly dawned on me that this happened every time and I realised alcohol does nothing good for me at all. It's expensive, unhealthy, slows my senses, makes me less funny, makes me worse at sex, makes me sleep wo…

A eureka moment was required for you to realize that... alcohol induces hangovers?

I used to think there was some kind of intake threshold and hangovers were the result of surpassing that threshold. The "eureka" moment was realising that any amount alcohol made me feel worse.

Re: America has a drinking problem

#660

Post by [deleted] »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #3

The statistics about alcohol consumption are so stunning that I often wonder how accurate they are. If these numbers are correct, the top 10% of alcohol drinkers consume the equivalent of 10 drinks per day : https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/25/think... The unit for a single drink is a fixed measurement, so someone pouring a tall glass of wine or a very stiff drink could be consuming 2-5 “drinks” in…

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