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WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

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Re: WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

#652

Post by evgen »

0x10c0fe11ce wrote: post #544
lrvick wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal is no better. You fell into one marketing trap with WhatsApp and have now fallen for another. Signal is another private entity with complete control of the servers and end client binaries. The fact they happen to open source the code is kind of moot since no services are allowed to write alternative implementations, no one can run their own servers or prove what code is running on Signals servers, nor can anyo…

Thanks for your insights, I’ll definitely look into Element/Mattix. I didn’t know Signal was just another scheme to collect private data. But I always knew that WhatsApp == FB yet I couldn’t do much due to network effects. Decentralizing the web has never been so important as now.

Signal is not another scheme to collect private data and anyone who makes such a claim has their own agenda to push (as you can see from the other comments in this thread made by this person.) Do a bit more research, get a wide variety of opinions, and then decide which factors are most important to you.

Re: WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

#654

Post by Lammy »

boredatworkme wrote: post #494

Can someone help and dumb this down a little bit for me so that I can then explain to some of my friends who couldn't care too much about this change in policy? For example: What should be my response to questions like: . "What kind of data can now be shared with FB versus what was shared earlier (if any)?" . "Whatsapp chats are end to end encrypted so how can my data be shared with FB?" . "As an individual, how diff…

> "Whatsapp chats are end to end encrypted so how can my data be shared with FB?"

I would stress to them the difference between the encrypted contents of a chat the metadata ("it's data about data!") of that chat.

Hopefully they will get it if you give an example of how just sending a message lets them profile you based on metadata like the exact time, geographic location, and recipient of the message, all without needing to see the contents. Encrypted messages sent from Truist Park at 2PM on a Sunday? Probably about baseball, etc etc.

Probably too high-level and wordy to share with a non-tech crowd but this is one of my favorite blog posts on this topic, from the immediately-post-Snowden era: https://kieranhealy.org/blog/archives/2013/06/09/using-metad...

Re: WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

#656

Post by teekert »

Aachen wrote: post #546
lrvick wrote: post #503

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you are going to move from one centralized, walled garden, privacy hostile platform that hard requires Google/Apple ecosystems to get signed updates... to another with identical drawbacks. I suggest something that lets you use any client/platform you want, uses the same crypto primitives, and lets you choose what server/country your data is hosted in and change your mind any time, e.g Matrix. How many times do cen…

Matrix is riddled with bugs. While I agree with you that signal isn't all that great (they do some really good stuff and then make some really weird trade-offs), I've recently compared Signal, Wire, Threema, Jami, Briar, Element/Matrix, and Keybase. The most mature app is Signal. It has the best usability to privacy trade-off. Threema is the better choice if you don't mind not having a usable desktop client. For me t…

For a family that are all on the same server, Nextcloud Talk is also nice and "relatively easy" to set up (and 0 effort when you already use Nextcloud). I am still desperately waiting on Talk being able to use the federation features of Nextcloud (so you can chat to users on other servers). That would increase my usage a lot, my parents are on another server (which admittedly also runs from my basement) and I have colleagues with their own server...

I do use Signal and Telegram with some friends, I really find the difference between WA and Signal to be small. Telegram though is a lot nicer as a platform, it has some channels I'm part of and the desktop client is much better. But this comes with privacy/security trade-offs as mentioned in this thread.

I also use Element.io for some channels and groups. I find it surprisingly nice. I may set up a server myself soon.

Re: WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

#657

Post by madeofpalk »

submeta wrote: post #467

I am in the EU, and this is what I have been presented with: „ By tapping Agree, you accept the new terms, which take effect on February 8, 2021. After this date, you’ll need to accept the new terms to continue using WhatsApp. You can also visit the Help Center if you would prefer to delete your account and would like more information. To learn more about how WhatsApp processes your data, read our updated privacy pol…

> Will start using Signal app

I can't do this because everyone else I know uses Whatsapp.

Re: WhatsApp gives users an ultimatum: Share data with Facebook or stop using app

#658

Post by Lammy »

malinens wrote: post #547
muzani wrote: post #407

"As part of the Facebook family of companies, WhatsApp receives information from, and shares information with, this family of companies. We may use the information we receive from them, and they may use the information we share with them, to help operate, provide, improve, understand, customize, support, and market our Services and their offerings. This includes helping improve infrastructure and delivery systems, un…

Looks like end to end encryption feature is bullshit marketing trick if they for example process my message before my device encrypts it to send it to other devices...

The encryption is also stripped when you back up your WhatsApp messages to Google Drive, along with a sweetheart zero-tier deal with Google to remove any possible downside that might make somebody think twice: https://faq.whatsapp.com/android/chats/about-google-drive-ba...

> WhatsApp backups no longer count against your Google Drive storage quota.

> Media and messages you back up aren't protected by WhatsApp end-to-end encryption while in Google Drive.

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