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Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

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Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#641

Post by Eisenstein »

uticus wrote: post #179
stackskipton wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OEM can change their mind at any moment and there is always going to be an MBA rubbing their hands together thinking about all the money that can be made. This needs to be solved at government level with right to repair laws and requirement for open standards instead of believing in magic of "free market".

> instead of believing in magic of "free market" It looks like magic because it works like magic. Surprisingly it is also possible to believe in the magic of "government intervention" though it looks less like magic and more like unintended consequences.

The thing is that not doing anything is still a policy decision. Unless you want to go full bore libertarian there will always be regulation. By saying that the market is magic and the government is intervention, then you ignore all of the intervention exists already and just saying you are fine with it.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#642

Post by gibspaulding »

pngwen wrote: post #631

Wouldn’t a “no-tech tractor “ be a mule? They are selling tractors based on internal combustion technology.

Mules are hybrids of donkey and horse. This was an important technological advancement some 3000 years ago, providing benefits of both breeds in one animal. The donkey and horse themselves of course are products of one of the most important technologies in human history - domestication!

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#643

Post by fchicken »

sl-1 wrote: post #579
fchicken wrote: post #482

Tech will consume itself. It is with glee that I will watch it burn.

Sadly it will also burn other stuff around. If it would only eat itself, I would watch with glee. But when it eats the life-sphere and our lifesupport before, I feel less gleeful

Life-sphere will learn a valuable lesson

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#644

Post by jcgrillo »

PunchyHamster wrote: post #617
jcgrillo wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you be accomplishing by trying to control end user behavior like that? As a manufacturer, there are certain standards your machine must meet when it leaves your factory. After that, a whole separate set of standards applies to users--e.g. EPA rules about emissions equipment tampering. As a manufacturer, though, you don't need to attempt enforcement. Leave that to the government, it's their job. Locked down…

It's to contain the regulation into little box that controls the emission, rather than span it to entire system making it harder to repair. Then the EPA can have its "proof" the vehicle emissions are fine without compromising entire system for repairs.

I think you're asking for something magical, like when politicians go on TV and demand safe cryptosystems with government backdoors. Any time you try to do engineering work to hinder users from using devices they own it's a really bad time. That's the purview of law enforcement, not engineering.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#645

Post by whizzter »

Hasz wrote: post #20

I think this is a reaction to the incredibly locked down ecosystem that most of these mfgs are pushing. However, the tech exists for a reason and is not inherently bad, the issue is the lock-in, the lack of choice and interoperability. IMO, there is plenty of space for an OEM who can play nice with others, offer an open (and vibrant ecosystem), and keep users coming back by choice, not by lock-in.

I think going bare-metal at cut-rate might've been the only way to actually kick-start that. F.ex. ECU's make things more optimal so buyers will be paying extra for fuel in a bad economy, but the lock-down was worse when it was causing downtime.

But tech in general is perhaps in a growing-up phase, we had Arduinos and Raspberry PI's filling a similar need (computer to electronics being needlessly complicated) that was initially filled from the low-end, but now we have faster SBC's and stuff like Framework laptop's that is expanding the range of options for repariable/replaceable/hackable parts up to the high end today and farming equipment is probably destined to get a similar range of options.

An interesting note here is, will cars also start getting a range of more hackable options, mechanics are ingenious already but it's still very much hacks without manufacturer support, but a new manufacturer providing a low-cost base could very well pop up and grow quickly if they establish an ecosystem.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#646

Post by stackedinserter »

culi wrote: post #221

Love to see repairability prioritized. The HN crowd would enjoy the Global Village Construction Kit's work on an open-source tractor https://www.opensourceecology.org/gvcs/ https://www.opensourceecology.org/portfolio/tractor/ https://www.opensourceecology.org/microtractor-workshop/ And their other open source machines they deemed "critical for civilization" https://www.opensourceecology.org/gvcs/gvcs-machine-index/

Does this project go anywhere? Looks like it's at the same stage it was 10 years ago.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#647

Post by 6510 »

stackedinserter wrote: post #646
culi wrote: post #221

Love to see repairability prioritized. The HN crowd would enjoy the Global Village Construction Kit's work on an open-source tractor https://www.opensourceecology.org/gvcs/ https://www.opensourceecology.org/portfolio/tractor/ https://www.opensourceecology.org/microtractor-workshop/ And their other open source machines they deemed "critical for civilization" https://www.opensourceecology.org/gvcs/gvcs-machine-index/

Does this project go anywhere? Looks like it's at the same stage it was 10 years ago.

Their internet things are quite terrible but they do workshops and build things.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#648

Post by jhassell »

pjc50 wrote: post #595
Ancapistani wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without going too far into the weeds here, IMO this experience is representative of gun rights, zoning, and all sorts of other differences between urban and rural. Rural kids are put into situations where they are expected to rely fully on themselves, with life-or-death consequences, from a young age. When your pre-teen is driving a machine on their own that could easily kill them or those around them, giving them a…

The phrasing of "gun rights" in the context that's really about gun responsibilities is a big part of the problem. And I say this from an unusual position; I'm a Brit who was taught to shoot at school (cadets). The urban gun control question is not so much about responsibility as about malice. There's not a huge number of people with murderous intent, but there are enough. And the resistance of rural America to the q…

[dead]

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#649

Post by lettergram »

happyopossum wrote: post #512
lettergram wrote: post #465

You can get a kubota M5-111 with a closed cab for $70k-100k, cheaper than these. Plus zero percent financing though then for 5-7 years. Well built and a comparable class in terms of weight and horse power. People aren’t buying them for price, but the first sentence discusses it as if it’s relevant. My assumption are farmers are trying to skirt the eco rules for vehicles in some way. Which by the way is insanely annoy…

105hp va 150hp is not a “comparable class”… Also, the ursa tractors have warranties too…

They're both considered medium tractors with similar weights for a similar purpose. I forget the official weights, but it's something like 100-175HP is mid-tier.

Re: Alberta startup sells no-tech tractors for half price

#650

Post by seanc »

Folks focus on the impact simplicity has on the customer, but it's also worth noting the impact it has on the manufacturer. With a simple product they get a simple business.

- Simple warranty support - No deep bench of customer support staff - No complex financing - Straightforward sales process

Heck, even the website is bare bones.

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