Earlier quoted context omitted.
With your logic, everything can be used, or change to be used in a bad way, so nothing should be changed. There is never a guarantee. Seriously, is there anything which cannot be changed to be shit, in the best case to be a worthless money pit? Edit: btw this proposal already has something which can be criticised: ID on mobile phones… so probably they’d lock everybody into a duopoly.
Yes, let's build the nuke and then put it in the center of London with a big red button. But don't worry, nobody will push the button. Or, proposal B: don't build the nuke.
Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
641–650 of 809 posts
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#642Earlier quoted context omitted.
Major difference between visiting a place and emigrating there. How many cultures actually learn another language just to go on their annual vacation? You seem to be arguing simultaneously that the Brits are worse than average when it comes to adapting to local norms as tourists, while also suggesting that the people moving to Britain permanently shouldn't have to? There's nothing wrong with a culture adapting over t…
> You seem to be arguing simultaneously that the Brits are worse than average when it comes to adapting to local norms as tourists, while also suggesting that the people moving to Britain permanently shouldn't have to? No. I’m arguing that people who say “people change their personalities to suit mine” are hypocrites. > But a small country can't preserve their identity when they are overloaded by so many immigrants c…
Assimilating doesn't mean changing one's personality. I'm still the same person I was before I came to the USA, but I respect that some things are customary and others are considered offensive. I know I'm expected to tip for services that in other countries would be considered insulting. Yet if enough immigrants refused to tip, it would become a stereotype that would create negative sentiment towards said immigrants because workers rely on that income.
> If you think a fraction of a percentage of people coming to the UK is suddenly going to change the identity of the entire country then you need to get out and explore more of the UK yourself.
I roadtripped across the UK earlier this year actually, spending time in 2 major cities and 4 small towns. The demographic shift over the last decade is immediately noticeable. It is multiple orders of magnitude more than you're making it out to be.
> I do think it’s courteous for people to make an effort to integrate. But it should also be their decision, not ours.
That's a matter of opinion, and perhaps not up to either you or me to decide whether it is right, but up to the % of citizens who will vote against immigration at the next election. Unchecked immigration is the top reason that western populations are shifting rightward. And this trend has evidently scared the Labour Party enough that they're finally preteneding to do something about it.
But let's say it is up to an immigrant to decide whether to integrate. What if their values are incompatible with the country's? If you move to the UK and take great offense over how people dress or their type of humor or their freedom of religion or their pub culture or whatever, why did you even move there? And if you then expect this entire sovereign nation (who is already doing you a favor by allowing you in) to change their ways to accommodate your beliefs, that is a hell of a lot more entitled than the other way around (the country expecting an individual to integrate as part of the terms of being let in).
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#643One thing is showing a passport to enter the gay bar, another thing is tap a phone and have time, person ID and bar ID recorded. Much faster. Also the mobile application can collect other data from the phone without distracting a user. So much more convenient.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#644When starting a job you already have to give enough ID to do the home offices job for them, this adds absolutely nothing.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#645Earlier quoted context omitted.
With your logic, everything can be used, or change to be used in a bad way, so nothing should be changed. There is never a guarantee. Seriously, is there anything which cannot be changed to be shit, in the best case to be a worthless money pit? Edit: btw this proposal already has something which can be criticised: ID on mobile phones… so probably they’d lock everybody into a duopoly.
You're arguing that the installation of a literal surveillance apparatus should be tolerated because technology can almost always be used for evil.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#646A secure, optional digital ID could be useful. But not in today’s UK. Why? Because the state has already shown it can’t be trusted with our data. - Snoopers’ Charter (Investigatory Powers Act 2016): ISPs must keep a year’s worth of records of which websites you visit. More than 40 agencies—from MI5 to the Welsh Ambulance Service—can request it. MI5 has already broken the rules and kept data it shouldn’t have. - Encry…
The ID cards as realized in many other countries are comparatively benign, because they are a physical credential in the possession of the person concerned. The government cannot stop this credential from being used except by physically confiscating it or by waiting (years) for it to expire. Distributed storage in action. The UK's proposal makes the "digital ID" a pointer to an entry in a centralized database. This d…
Penury and deportation are quite a bit of scope already! Maybe they'll put an "arrest" bit in there. Warrants are already a thing. I don't see the UK going in for murder just yet. What's left?
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#647Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thats a bold statement - certainly possibly as a factor but to 4x it that seems unlikely. It sounds like you are callously dismissing valid concerns.
Why use absolute numbers rather than per capita? What is the link between rape and immigration?
There is also a recent video of a girl wielding an ax and knife to protect her and her sister in Scotland [3]. She has been charged with brandishing weapons. Interestingly, the BBC has issued an article [4] claiming that it was a "Bulgarian couple" that the girls approached, and to not "spread misinformation." I am a researcher of Slavic languages, so I can tell you from watching the video in [3] that the accents featured in this video are not Bulgarian. I am not willing to stake a claim in what they actually are (someone else is welcome to comment).
Actually, I'm quite alarmed that the BBC is claiming this, as I generally consider the BBC reputable.
1 – https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cdd2rld9mj2o
2 – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotherham_child_sexual_exploit...
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#648Earlier quoted context omitted.
Huh? Spyware, ransomware, etc. is a dangerous problem on rooted phones. It's the unrooted ones that have protections against it.
They're talking about government spyware. Why not install a little bit extra into that digital ID app
If you root your phone and install apps, your apps can do anything and spy all they want.
So the comment still makes zero sense.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#649Earlier quoted context omitted.
Mandatory ID cards are a cultural no-no in the UK. They were required during WW2, then discontinued in peacetime. People burned them in the street. You are not required to show ID to a police officer. Even when driving you don’t need to show a license on the spot, though if stopped for cause you have to present it at a police station within three days. At least those were the rules when I was a young driver there. Th…
I don't understand why Americans hold freedom of speech / the First Amendment in such high regard. What does it buy you? Major corruption, abuse and misconduct still happens. Being able to criticise your government doesn't seem to matter in the social media age. Look at the state of politics in the US right now. Seems like it's slightly redundant these days – a bit anachronistic? Kind of odd the obsession with it. (p…
Well, for one thing, it's not a transactional question of what it "buys". It's a matter of principle and defense against future repression or manipulation by politicians on a power trip.
For example, given Trump's current and blatant attempts to crush free expression against his own policies and bullshit, or even those who constantly insult and criticize him (whining about it like a little kid actually) imagine how much easier he'd have had it if there were no U.S 1st amendment to use against him.
There's an example of its value. It's just one of many.
If you think being able to protect free expression and the ability to speak out freely against power and its abuse is anachronistic, then I don't know what else to say except that you're a naive or dishonest fool, and possibly part of the very problem in places where péople just don't seem to care that under pretext X or Y, they can be stifled at any time.
Yes, the social media companies produce, or facilitate the production of, vast amounts of misinformation, disinformation and even hate speech, but guess what? All that shit gets produced en masse anyhow by repressive authoritarian regimes with narratives to construct and agendas to maintain. Free speech certainly isn't at fault for its existence, given that such things have existed since there's been propaganda or a perceived need for it.
At least, in a place like the U.S, where free speech remains protected (for now at least), any misinformation, disinformation or whatever speech by those in power or outside of it who create it, can be countered by others trying to speak more truthfully.
Try doing the same against misinformation and disinformation by government in Russia, or many other countries where "anachronistic" free speech is curtailed right to hell.
In essence, when governments can legally censor speech they decide is misinformation, disinformation or "hate speech", they can create all sorts of um, interesting, rubrics for deciding what fits under these labels, and then oops, by coincidence it can be anything that goes against their agendas. Going back to the Trump example, just pause for a moment to think about all the uncomfortable facts and opinions he loves to label as "fake news" or "misinformation" or even as hate speech. Now imagine him having the legal authority to sweep them away.
Nothing in any state guarantees against a future leadership with similar authoritarian proclivities from forming to use anti-free speech laws in similar ways.
There, my good faith response to your completely absurd line of rhetorical questioning.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#650Earlier quoted context omitted.
> All it takes is one breach or vulnerability and then yes, they DO have access to all your data. No they don't. If they breach the health system, they don't have access to tax returns. Just because people are identified by a single ID number doesn't mean all their data is being stored on the same server. And for purely organizational reasons, that's incredibly unlikely to happen. And I don't know what you mean by "s…
When a credential is stolen, its validity across multiple unrelated services is often checked by credential stuffing. That's just one type of simple attack. Has cybercrime been rendered obsolete with a government credential? Why is this master account immune to theft? On the contrary, it appears to be a credential that once stolen, could be more impactful than having your primary email account and phone compromised.…
The subject was a system being breached.
And the account you set up for a driver's license is generally different from the one for your health care. If you're reusing the same password for both it doesn't matter if they're linked by the same digital ID number or the same email address or just the same name and birthday.
A digital ID number isn't changing anything here.