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AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

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Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#641

Post by ezst »

ksec wrote: post #636
motorest wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap. No, that is not the cost of keeping "the value" within western economies. It would be the cost of granting the US a leverage against the collective west. The US proved to be a very unreliable and outright hostile partner. At this point, it is not clear whether the US is more hostile to…

US has been a reliable partner post WWII for 95%+ of the time. Making Trump administration representing 100+ years of US history isn't exactly a fair comparison.

Yeah, that ship sailed the second time Americans voted for him.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#642

Post by xadhominemx »

Mountain_Skies wrote: post #632
tarkin2 wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If something happens to Taiwan, the USA will have given a huge military advantage to its biggest adversary. It's going to take decades for the USA to catch up with Taiwan, and once China has its grip on the fabs they'll only further advance them. In an existential crisis, the chances of Taiwan's leadership doing a deal with China when it's military protector retreats from its former declarations is in no way low. It'…

How did that come to be? The US used to be the world leader in chip manufacturing and that wasn't all that long ago. Why was something so critical given away so freely?

It was not given away - it was won by the Taiwanese, who bet on the fabless-foundry business model and executed magnificently.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#643

Post by redleader55 »

ksec wrote: post #636
motorest wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap. No, that is not the cost of keeping "the value" within western economies. It would be the cost of granting the US a leverage against the collective west. The US proved to be a very unreliable and outright hostile partner. At this point, it is not clear whether the US is more hostile to…

US has been a reliable partner post WWII for 95%+ of the time. Making Trump administration representing 100+ years of US history isn't exactly a fair comparison.

I don't think most people would contest the 100 years you mentioned.

If we look at the military investments US did since Clinton(so, last 30 years), you'll notice a trend of looking after it's own interests before the ones of the world. An example is the lack of investment in destroyers to patrol the seas, while at the same time the focus shifted to super-carriers which are good for one thing: obliterate a single, powerful country.

This is not just Trump, but everyone after Bush Sr.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#644

Post by motorest »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #592
potatototoo99 wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very well? There hasn't been open war between EU countries since WW2.

>Very well? I meant with EU Russia and Ukraine. Plus, France and German economies were also connected before WW2 and that didn't stop the war. And the economies of former Yugoslav nations were very well connected, that didn't stop them going to war with each other. What stopped the wars after WW2 was western Europe being under the rule of a nuclear superpower needing to unite against a bigger nuclear superpower next…

> I meant with EU Russia and Ukraine.

Do you believe Russia and Ukraine are a part of the EU?

> Plus, France and German economies were also connected before WW2 and that didn't stop the war.

Even if we ignore the complete ignorance required to make that statement and take it at face value, keep in mind that the interwar period lasted little more than 20 years. The EU's inception started in the early 1950s with the treaty of Rome being signed in 1957. So at this point the EU's track record on peace is already twice as long as your reference period, and counting.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#645

Post by motorest »

ksec wrote: post #636
motorest wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap. No, that is not the cost of keeping "the value" within western economies. It would be the cost of granting the US a leverage against the collective west. The US proved to be a very unreliable and outright hostile partner. At this point, it is not clear whether the US is more hostile to…

US has been a reliable partner post WWII for 95%+ of the time. Making Trump administration representing 100+ years of US history isn't exactly a fair comparison.

> US has been a reliable partner post WWII for 95%+ of the time.

The current US administration has been threatening two separate NATO allies with invasion and annexation.

Not even Russia, with their daily Russian last warnings of nuclear Armageddon, dare being that hostile.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#646

Post by redleader55 »

azernik wrote: post #634
blitzar wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If something happens to the US, we won't regret being able to produce these chips domestically. For the rest of the world, Taiwan with a "China Risk" looks like a safer bet than the USA.

The way to reduce the risk is to diversify. Taiwan with a China risk and the US with a "US risk" is much safer than either alone.

In a world of US and China being at odds with each other and controlling a GPU factory each, AI for Europe, Japan, Australia, etc becomes a game of who can kiss ass better and hoping the master doesn't change the rules further.

There should be more places that can produce enough energy and have AI leverage.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#647

Post by windward »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #592
potatototoo99 wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very well? There hasn't been open war between EU countries since WW2.

>Very well? I meant with EU Russia and Ukraine. Plus, France and German economies were also connected before WW2 and that didn't stop the war. And the economies of former Yugoslav nations were very well connected, that didn't stop them going to war with each other. What stopped the wars after WW2 was western Europe being under the rule of a nuclear superpower needing to unite against a bigger nuclear superpower next…

Russia has 18% interest rates, 9% inflation, and a demographic deficit of hundreds of thousands of working age men.

So we'll see if anyone wants the same.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#648

Post by notepad0x90 »

avhception wrote: post #342

If that is the cost of keeping the value within the western economies, we should pay. Plain and simple. I'd even argue it's cheap.

who is we? should tax payers foot the difference? Innovation follows the money, not patriotism.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#649

Post by ekianjo »

guywithahat wrote: post #437
fishsticks89 wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If something happens to Taiwan, we won't regret being able to produce these chips domestically. If AI keeps growing like it does, it might even trigger a conflict.

Ironically my only opposition to US chips is that we’re less liable to protect Taiwan if China invades

there is no way the US would go to war with China over Taiwan anyway.

Re: AMD CEO sees chips from TSMC's US plant costing 5%-20% more

#650

Post by vkazanov »

leptons wrote: post #428
vkazanov wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds weird. I have 2 intel/dell laptops and thinkpad/amd 14s laptop. Both Dells (a workstation-class 22 core cpu and a more power-efficient one) suck massively when compared to amd ai-something-something-ryzen. What's worse, intel drivers are a mess on linux right now. Dell xps 13 plus is the worst laptop I had in a decade, and that's after owning every Linux-preinstalled Dell XPS 13 ever released.

"Sounds weird"??? Not really sure what you mean by that. Both our Intel and AMD computers are doing great. Nothing "weird" about it. No problems at all. YMMV.

What i mean is that it's relatively hard to find an intel laptop that would be meaningfully faster than an amd one. For a while Intel was surviving on quality software but even this moat is drying out.
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