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Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

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Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#641
post #607

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI has now evolved beyond just the science and it's biggest issue is in the productization. Finding use cases for what's already available ALONG with new models will be where success lies. ChatGPT is the number 1 brand in AI and as such needs to learn what it's selling, not how its technology works. It always sucks when mission and vision don't align with the nerds ideas, but I think it's probably the best move for b…

> ChatGPT is the number 1 brand in AI and as such needs to learn what it's selling, not how its technology works. I'm not as in tune as some people here so: don't they need both? With the rate at which things are moving, how can it be otherwise?

They do need both but it seems like they have enough engineering talent to keep improving. Time will tell now that Ilya is out but I expect they have enough cultural cache to attract excellent engineers even if they aren’t as famous as Ilya and Karpathy.

They have a strong focus on making the existing models fast and cheap without sacrificing capability which is music to the ears of those looking to build with them.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#642
post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have they earned a return on it yet? Seriously asking; I've purchased a GitHub CoPilot license subscription but I don't know what their sales numbers are doing on AI in general. It's to be seen if it can be made more cost-efficient to deliver to consumers.

Checking MSFT price, seems like the market thinks they made the right move and the shareholders are for sure seeing a return.

The market thinks Tesla is worth more than all other automakers combined, that GameStop is a reasonable investment, and laying off engineers is great!

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#643

At least now we know GPT-5 has finished development and is now in training from this (I would hope that Iyla got to add all that he hoped to before leaving). Ilya, thanks for all you have contributed within OpenAI!

GPT-5ANDBAG more like it He wouldn't have left if he could advance hoomanity further there, the guy has like a 800ms delay for each word and that does not make for a very good liar, perhaps a dutiful one.

The word delay depends on who he is talking to. On his Dwarkesh interview from a year or so back he speed up noticeably, presumably because Dwarkesh is a fast thinker/talker.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#644
post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except if you're Anthropic or OpenAI you don't care about what your compute provider has done in the AI space - you care about the compute power they can give you.

That's exactly what I'm talking about: https://i.imgur.com/sZ3tniY.jpeg

But how many of those are ordered specifically for OpenAI, and are on order as a result of them to begin with? Do you think if we were in a parallel universe where OpenAI ended up partnering with Google or Amazon instead, the GPU shipments would look the same? I think they would reflect wherever OpenAI ended up doing all their compute showing a pretty similar lion's share.

Your claim was that people should care about compute based on what the provider has done in the AI space, but Microsoft was pretty far behind on that side until OpenAI - Google was really the only player in town. Should they have wanted GCP credits instead? Do you care about their AI results or the ex post facto GPU shipments?

Or, if what you actually want to argue is that Anthropic would be able to get more GPUs with Azure than AWS or GCP then this is a different argument which is going to require different evidence than raw GPU shipments.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#645
post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike AI in the past, there is now massive amounts of money going into AI. And the number things humans are still doing significantly better than AI is going down continously now. If something like Q* is provided organically with GPT5 (which may have a different name), and allows proper planning, error correction and direct interaction with tools, that gaps is getting really close to 0.

AI in the past (adjusted for 1980s) was pretty well funded. It's just that fundamental scientific discovery bears little relationship to the pallets of cash.

Funding in the 1980s was sometimes very good. My company bought me an expensive Lisp Machine in 1982 and after that, even in “AI winters” it mostly seemed that money was available.

AI has a certain mystique that helps get money. In the 1980s I was on a DARPA neural network tools advisory panel, and I concurrently wrote a commercial product that included the 12 most common network architectures. That allowed me to step in when a project was failing (a bomb detector we developed for the FAA) that used a linear model, with mediocre results. It was a one day internal consult to provide software for a simple one hidden layer backprop model. During that time I was getting mediocre results using symbolic AI for NLP, but the one success provided runway internally in my company to keep going.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#646
post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some first ideas coming to mind: Engineering Level: Solve CO2 Levels End sickness/death Enhance cognition by integrating with willing minds. Safe and efficient interplanetary travel. Harness vastly higher levels of energy (solar, nuclear) for global benefit. Science: Uncover deeper insights into the laws of nature. Explore fundamental mysteries like the simulation hypothesis, Riemann hypothesis, multiverse theory, an…

Do you believe the average human has general intelligence, and do you believe the average human can intellectually achieve these things in ways existing technology cannot?

Yes, considering that AI operates differently from human minds, there are several advantages:

  AI does not experience fatigue or distractions => consistent performance.
  AI can scale its processing power significantly, despite the challenges associated with it (I understand the challenges)
  AI can ingest and process new information at an extraordinary speed.
  AIs can rewrite themselves
  AIs can be multiplicated (solving scarcity of intelligence in manufacturing)
  Once achieving AGI, progress could compound rapidly, for better or worse, due to the above points.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#648
post #594

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except OpenAI hasn’t yet finished discovery on its true goal: AGI. I wonder if they risk plateauing at a local maximum.

I'm genuinely curious: what do you expect an "AGI" system to be able to do that we can't do with today's technology?

The simplest answer, without adding any extraordinary capabilities to the AGI that veer into magical intelligence, is to have AI assistants that can seemlessly interact with technology the way a human assistant would.

So, if you want to meet with someone, instead of opening you calendar app and looking for an opening, you'd ask your AGI assistant to talk to their AGI assistant and set up a 1h meeting soon. Or, instead of going on Google to find plane tickets, you'd ask you AGI assistant to find the most reasonable tickets for a certain date range.

This would not require any special intelligence more advanced than a human's, but it does require a very general understanding of the human world that is miles beyond what LLMs can achieve today.

Going only slightly further with assumptions about how smart an AGI would be, it could revolutionize education, at any level, by acting as a true personalized tutor for a single student, or even for a small group of students. The single biggest problem in education is that it's impossible to scale the highest quality education - and an AGI with capabilities similar to a college professor would entirely solve that.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#649
post #627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm genuinely curious: what do you expect an "AGI" system to be able to do that we can't do with today's technology?

Some first ideas coming to mind: Engineering Level: Solve CO2 Levels End sickness/death Enhance cognition by integrating with willing minds. Safe and efficient interplanetary travel. Harness vastly higher levels of energy (solar, nuclear) for global benefit. Science: Uncover deeper insights into the laws of nature. Explore fundamental mysteries like the simulation hypothesis, Riemann hypothesis, multiverse theory, an…

The incentives aren't structured properly for these things to happen, it has always been a sci-fi fairy tale that AGI would achieve these things.

Re: Ilya Sutskever to leave OpenAI

#650
post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike AI in the past, there is now massive amounts of money going into AI. And the number things humans are still doing significantly better than AI is going down continously now. If something like Q* is provided organically with GPT5 (which may have a different name), and allows proper planning, error correction and direct interaction with tools, that gaps is getting really close to 0.

AI in the past (adjusted for 1980s) was pretty well funded. It's just that fundamental scientific discovery bears little relationship to the pallets of cash.

> AI in the past (adjusted for 1980s) was pretty well funded.

A tiny fraction of the current funding. 2-4 orders of magnitude less.

> It's just that fundamental scientific discovery bears little relationship to the pallets of cash

Heavy funding may not automatically lead to breakthroughs such as Special Relativity or Quantum Mechanics (though it helps there too). But once the most basic ideas are in place, massive is what causes the breakthroughs like in the Manhatten Project and Apollo Program.

And it's not only the money itself. It's the attention and all the talent that is pulled in due to that.

And in this case, there is also the fear that the competition will reach AGI first, whether the competition is a company or a foreign government.

It's certainly possible the the ability to monetize the investments may lead to some kind of slowdown at some point (like if there is a recession).

But it seems to me that such a recession will have no more impact on the development of AGI than the dotcom bust had for the importance of the internet.

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