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AWS and Blockchain

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Re: AWS and Blockchain

#641

Post by danny_codes »

everfree wrote: post #556
kkielhofner wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand setting the internet "big bang" date somewhere in the 80s. The big bang was the web which was at least 1990-1993 (CERN says 1993). In 1990-1993 and beyond for the next few years a tiny portion of US households even had a computer that was capable (modem, etc) of getting on the internet/web. Arguably until AOL it was also extremely expensive. When I got on the internet it was with an inflation adjus…

> blockchain has had plenty of time, audience, etc for widespread adoption Blockchains have been in a dial-up era. Bitcoin only supports balance transfers and has a hard-coded throughput limit of 1 Megabyte every 10 minutes (1990s modem speeds), and that effectively represented the state of the art of blockchain technology for 6 years. Until 2015, you couldn't even run a simple script on a blockchain (I don't count B…

Name one app that would be killer.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#642

Post by dmitriid »

pjkundert wrote: post #604
dmitriid wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> could potentially scale to 1B users -- and nobody could stop it. Some static assets would need to be tuned in a real App, to be hosted by a CDN like Cloudflare You've just show at least one way how it would be stopped. Who exactly is going to pay for static assets delivered to 1B users via Cloudflare? > but the App itself would scale. Of course it wouldn't. None of the blockchains have the required throughput. Yes,…

Hmm, okay. For others that come later in search of information, I'll address some of these. > ... one way it can be stopped. Yes, this newbie developer made some decisions that couldn't scale to 1B users. Alternatively, each node can serve static assets, thus scaling linearly w/o CDNs. This isn't required for most apps, as they aren't targets for state-level actors seeking to deplatform them from CDNs. But, if a tota…

It unsurprising how you went from "could potentially scale to 1B users -- and nobody could stop it, this is new" to "of course it cannot scale, but this is still new"

So what exactly is new, and how can it scale?

Note: for a newbie Glitch and Itch are infinitely more scalable, and more innovative.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#643

Post by habinero »

halpmeh wrote: post #624
habinero wrote: post #622

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contracts aren't for when things go right, they're for when things go wrong. It's just as true to say contacts aren't "necessary" 99% of the time, because people follow through on the agreement.

I think you’re conflating legal contracts and smart contracts. Legal contracts are instruments used by two or more parties that outlines their responsibilities to one another in a way that is protected by civil law. A smart contract is just a program that runs on the blockchain.

Sure, but they're called smart contracts because they're meant to literally codify an agreement.

If you just want to trigger actions based on something and then store it, you don't need the machinery of the blockchain.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#644

Post by habinero »

RestlessMind wrote: post #639
habinero wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This ridiculous straw man comes up all the time. Stop it. Nobody said "governments are always good" or denied that dictatorships exist. The rest of this is pure irrational FUD. Democracies are not dictatorships. A president doesn't have the legal authority to freeze finances like that. They are not a king.

> The rest of this is pure irrational FUD. Democracies are not dictatorships. Please get your facts straight. This happened in Canada, one of the supposedly best democracies out there "The Attorney General of Ontario sought and was granted an Ontario Superior Court of Justice court order under Section 490.8 of the Criminal Code of Canada against GiveSendGo,[69] to freeze the funds collected from two campaigns, "Freed…

You're letting your conspiracy politics cloud your thinking. This entire screed is entirely irrational FUD. Stop.

Canadian banks and regulators looking into potential money laundering is entirely reasonable and appropriate behavior.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#645

Post by BenoitP »

dandanua wrote: post #285
BenoitP wrote: post #182

In case anyone needs a thorough source to explain why you don't need a Blockchain, I found the NIST paper (esp the flowchart on page 42) quite helpful: https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/ir/2018/nist.ir.8202.pdf It worked wonderfully to cut the BS coming from a greedy manager, in a non confrontational way ("so, what do you actually need?" , "you say 'security', but which aspect do you need? immutability ? non-repudiab…

That's an excellent flowchart. BTW, there is a real example of meaningful blockchain use for auditing single source data (the "caveat" in the flowchart). It's the hypercore protocol https://hypercore-protocol.org/

That's very interesting. Would you mind coming up with a concrete and detailed business case? In this example you will provide, who are the entities with write access? How do they have a hard time deciding who should be control of the data store?

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#646

Post by everfree »

danny_codes wrote: post #641
everfree wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> blockchain has had plenty of time, audience, etc for widespread adoption Blockchains have been in a dial-up era. Bitcoin only supports balance transfers and has a hard-coded throughput limit of 1 Megabyte every 10 minutes (1990s modem speeds), and that effectively represented the state of the art of blockchain technology for 6 years. Until 2015, you couldn't even run a simple script on a blockchain (I don't count B…

Name one app that would be killer.

Public auditing software that transparently shows how government or charity funds are being spent in real time - from the incoming tax proceeds, through each agency and department, down to (when appropriate) every individual purchase, with each transaction digitally signed by a person who could be held accountable.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#647

Post by deanCommie »

TimJRobinson wrote: post #268
runeks wrote: post #167

Blockchain was invented to solve one particular problem: distributed consensus on a sequence of transactions, where the choice of which transaction to include from a set of conflicting transactions is irrelevant. The latter property here is key to understanding where blockchain is useful. It was created to solve the "double spend problem", ie. two transitions that spend the same coin but send it to different recipien…

I used to think this, but working with DeFi on Ethereum for a while I've realized the killer feature is actually permissionless composability. Which is why enterprise block chains make little sense. Having one neutral platform, controlled by no one, with standardized API's and immutable open programs that anyone can permissionlessly build on - is amazing. We've never had this before, and it's incredible how fast the…

> Hidden Hand is a marketplace for governance incentives, commonly referred to as "bribes". Protocols can leverage Hidden Hand to enable more efficient governance processes and to engage their voters, while users can earn extra yield on their favorite vote escrowed governance tokens through bribes.

https://hiddenhand.finance/

I...i mean this just speaks for itself doesn't it?

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#648

Post by dmitriid »

pjkundert wrote: post #548
sangnoir wrote: post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're No-true-Scottsman'ing DeFi by excluding FTX after the fact. I posit there is no way to tell apart the "real" DeFi from the Crap-coins. If you can tell them apart, which tokens and/or exchanges will fail next, and when? There's a pervasive aura of "secret knowledge" in crypto, where the in-group think of themselves as superior operators who scoff as the noobs get fleeced[1]; yet these suave traders continually…

Pretty much everyone credible has been warning people to get off all exchanges, since well, forever. Because you can't (and shouldn't) "trust" someone. If you want to trust someone, go to a bank. This isn't really too much a matter of "secret knowledge", but historical fact. But, hope springs eternal. And, self-referential Crap Coins (like Luna) are just, well, insane at first glance. Trust-based "Staking" for return…

> Dedicated, competent and highly-funded attackers are at work. Central/commercial banks, Treasuries, etc. cannot abide any fire-exit

First-world tech bros drinking cool-aid and shoveling money by the truckload with zero understanding of finance, and in it just for scams, get rich schemes and money: check.

"It's a coordinated attack by the Big Money and State Actors" whine: also check.

> So, the stakes for attackers are high. The stakes for liberty-valuing citizens: even higher.

Spare us the bullshit.

"DeFi" is literally just currency speculation and flash loans, all of them happening with fantasy tokens. But it's a big circle jerk because blockchain and programs in esoteric programming languages on inefficient esoteric VMs (yes, that's what "smart" "contracts" are).

All of the crypto scams and failures are entirely on those in crypto space. No highly-funded attackers needed. You're busy doing it to yourselves.

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#649

Post by mike_hearn »

gendal wrote: post #424
mike_hearn wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You actually know something about the finance industry, not sure this is the thread for you ;) You're absolutely right about the core problem. I worked for several years on an 'enterprise blockchain' system. We often called it distributed ledger technology because our platform didn't actually use chains of blocks or proof of work, and it didn't have a token or anything like that. It was essentially a type of database…

Hi everybody... Richard Brown, CTO of R3, the firm behind Corda, here. As Mike says, we're somewhat unusual in that there are many live, successful Corda deployments around the world. Mike's comment about how Corda is blockchain-like but not, strictly speaking, a chain of blocks is at the heart of this I think. Here's what I mean: How many 'introductory' presentations have you been to (or, worse, given ) to semi-tech…

I think your interpretation is fine :) Maybe I was aiming for a fully generalized decentralized database, but in the end there's probably too many finance or business-specific concepts in the core model to really deserve the title. At least in Corda 4.

And I should have given you more credit in my post, apologies for that. Indeed Corda has successful 'blockchain' projects where other platforms often don't, largely because of your rigorous problem-definition-first mentality that kept us seeing Bitcoin/Ethereum as a bag of useful ideas rather than a template that we had to follow. It was a great collaboration which I enjoyed a lot, and the platform was very fundamentally shaped by your efforts and insights!

Re: AWS and Blockchain

#650

Post by oblio »

TimJRobinson wrote: post #620
habinero wrote: post #599

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Owning gold/silver is legal. It's also regulated - it's not legal tender. Investing in a business is legal. It also means sending money, which is regulated by KYC/AML and you're still responsible for taxes.

Investing in small businesses isn't legal because you need to be an accredited investor which only the top 1% of the wealth pyramid qualify for. It's these kinds of rules to "save people from themselves" that have the bonus effect of the rich gatekeeping the best investments that make a lot of people mad and see the current system as corrupt. Being able to spend and invest my money how I want should not be a crime.

> Investing in small businesses isn't legal because you need to be an accredited investor which only the top 1% of the wealth pyramid qualify for.

Whaaaaat? Sorry, but that comment makes no sense. You can buy a share in any small business you want.

You're mistaking this for some types of stock market investments[1], which are made to "save people from themselves", from back in the day before 1929 when access was free for all and hawkers peddling crappy stock brought the entire world economy to a halt by getting the general population to join the stock market casino (slight exaggeration, but not by much).

[1] And guess what, your sister's lemonade stand isn't listed on the NYSE or even on the Romanian BVB :-p

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