The end of the manual transmission is near? • Hacker News Board

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#641

Post by masklinn » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:11 PM UTC

randunel wrote: post #491

fragmede wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Technology advanced and CVTs and 10-speed dual-clutch automatic transmissions are now more (by 1-2 mpg) more efficient than manual transmissions.

I doubt it's changed under real driving conditions, with hills, valleys and overtaking happening frequently, where all types of automatic transmissions perform poorly (they can't possibly anticipate an oncoming hill or overtaking, whereas the driver manually shifts to the correct gear beforehand).

Every automatic car I’ve driven would e.g. quickly downshift when pressing down the accelerator, and while this can be laggy with older AMTs I’d assume it’s not an issue on modern gearboxes, at least the not-super-cheapo ones.

But probably more relevant, all automatics I’ve driven have “manual” shifters (paddles or +/- selector on the gear lever) which let you override the gearbox’s decisions, to an extent.

So nothing precludes anticipating your gearing, even on an automatic.

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#642

Post by lupire » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:11 PM UTC

bregma wrote: post #546

tadfisher wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they're not classified as passenger vehicles, so they don't have to meet the same standards.

I understand, but a modern pickup truck comfortably seats 6 in its King Cab (and good luck finding a truck without a King Cab) and has a bed that is useless for carrying anything except maybe your gym bag or a dozen cases of empties. There is no doubt the purpose of a modern pickup truck is as a passenger vehicle and secondarily to provide an advertising medium for you political beliefs. The fact that modern American…

What's missing is that those "worksite" trucks should require a special commercial drivers license and extra testing for the professional drivers who drive them, same as big rigs. And not be allowed for non-work trips like driving to school.

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#643

Post by stephencanon » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:12 PM UTC

xattt wrote: post #127

jlkuester7 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty cool to read about somebody using their Porsche the same way I use my 12yo Toyota Rav4! My record is still fitting a full-sized washer and dryer in the back... Don't feel silly for utilizing your vehicle's capabilities!

Past Nissan Cube owner here reporting that you can stuff a twin mattress against the ceiling of the car, supported by the heads of the driver and passenger, for several blocks.

I moved a queen bed frame and mattress in a 2006 mini convertible.

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#644

Post by kkielhofner » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:12 PM UTC

JoBrad wrote: post #617

Retric wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me guess, you don’t live next to farmers or a lot of snow.

I live next to a few people who keep their $80,000 truck immaculate, and will never touch an unpaved field with it. The best trucks for driving in snow and mud are the trucks that actual farm hands drive, and are usually far less decked out, have mismatched paint schemes, and are covered in scratches and dirt. Completely their choice to make that purchase, obviously, but I’ve seen worse vehicle choices. However when…

I live in a rural area where pickup trucks are used for farm tasks, hunting (deer season, coyote season is every day), construction, towing, etc at a much higher rate than you probably see across the US in average.

Among the community of people that use their trucks for "real work" (whatever their definition of that may be) an immaculately kept truck like the one you're describing would be referred to as a "pavement princess".

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#645

Post by lupire » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:14 PM UTC

jbverschoor wrote: post #457

vladvasiliu wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There already were a few before, but now Dodge must have done something "right" because there really are many RAMs around. Those things are so ridiculous for Paris, that I'm pretty sure they don't even fit through some streets. Hell, my father used to have a fairly common French sedan that would sometimes need a lot of maneuvering through the public garage ramps, and would barely fit in the parking slots.

In NL, a RAM can be bought as a company car, effectively dodging road tax. (50 euro vs 200 euro per month). For comparison, you pay 100 euro per month for a tiny car if it runs on diesel (these were 'green' and exempt from road tax 10 years ago). Or between 30 and 70 per month for gasoline cars.

Do company cars not use roads?

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#646

Post by lupire » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:15 PM UTC

Dobbs wrote: post #517

badpun wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's 200 euros road tax PER MONTH in NL? OMG and TIL.

We have the best or second best roads in the world (which is very noticeable when you drive into neighboring countries). Additionally we have extremely low congestion even at rush hour. Road tax depends heavily on the vehicle. I think we pay ~€1000 a year, ~€83 a month, for our Hyundai ix35.

US "road tax" is in the gasoline tax. (Plus a nominal fee for electric cars in some places) Does NL have gas tax? What's that used for?

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#647

Post by mindslight » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:15 PM UTC

JoBrad wrote: post #617

Retric wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me guess, you don’t live next to farmers or a lot of snow.

I live next to a few people who keep their $80,000 truck immaculate, and will never touch an unpaved field with it. The best trucks for driving in snow and mud are the trucks that actual farm hands drive, and are usually far less decked out, have mismatched paint schemes, and are covered in scratches and dirt. Completely their choice to make that purchase, obviously, but I’ve seen worse vehicle choices. However when…

A basic driving license will allow you to drive a 26,000lb GVWR box truck with an actual length of 34 feet. Is this the right call? It doesn't seem to be a problem, because very few people are buying such large trucks for daily drivers.

The talk about "farm vehicle" is a red herring in this whole thread. Actual farm plates are rare. The significant distinction is cosplayer vs contractor, which happens to be independent of commercial plates.

The right answer is probably charging yearly registration (/road use) fees based on GVWR. This is already common for trailers. There should be a part that scales as the road wear from weight does. I think it's something like the third or fourth power?

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#648

Post by koheripbal » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:15 PM UTC

AuthorizedCust wrote: post #639

lupire wrote: post #638

As gas cars are headed to deprecation in California with others likely to follow, EV designers are creating manual transmission designs. Currently only a couple of $100K+ models (Porsche and Audi) have it. Toyota and Jeep are working on more. https://www.motorbiscuit.com/electric-vehicles-manual-transm...

That’s silly, retrofitting a technology for a different platform into a platform that doesn’t need it!

They're really just mislabeling it for nostalgia and marketing.

It's actually just a control to increase torque more aggressively on command for increased acceleration beyond what is normally needed for casual driving.

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#649

Post by kllrnohj » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:16 PM UTC

randunel wrote: post #491

fragmede wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Technology advanced and CVTs and 10-speed dual-clutch automatic transmissions are now more (by 1-2 mpg) more efficient than manual transmissions.

I doubt it's changed under real driving conditions, with hills, valleys and overtaking happening frequently, where all types of automatic transmissions perform poorly (they can't possibly anticipate an oncoming hill or overtaking, whereas the driver manually shifts to the correct gear beforehand).

What you're talking about makes a manual have fewer torque brownouts for lack of a better term, but they'd cost efficiency not gain it. Being in a lower gear before you need it is worse for mpg than being in it slightly "too late"

Re: The end of the manual transmission is near?

#650

Post by dumpsterlid » Thu, Aug 25, 2022, 1:16 PM UTC

AlexandrB wrote: post #299

Retric wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You asked why, and the answer is cost vs benefit. Car styling alone doesn’t justify the risk to pedestrians, large truck utility can. Yes, this tradeoff kills people, but so do all sorts of things like not physically preventing cars from driving 80+MPH.

This is a non answer. Australia has a vehicle style commonly referred to as a "ute"[1]. I think it stand for "utility". Which is basically a car with a truck bed in the back. This provides many of the advantages of a pickup without the increased danger to pedestrians. Why are car companies not marketing/selling these to the average consumer instead of the monster RAMs and F150s? I suspect the reason has everything to…

I would argue the minivan is the most comically underloved vehicle in the US given how perfectly it fulfills what people want from their vehicle. There is little reason to buy a ute style vehicle over a minivan in my opinion. I had to buy a used car last year (I have no kids, just a girlfriend and no plans in the near future for kids if ever.. lol who can afford that shit?) and used car prices were/are? absolutely insane. I widened my search to pretty much any car type and decided to look for a remote job/job with a very short commute so I wouldnt have to buy a gas efficient vehicle. I wanted basically a honda civic type vehicle but even old beat up honda civics with 250,000 miles driven by high schoolers were still far too expensive for what you were getting.

...then I realized that one of the vehicles taxi companies use are toyota siennas and read some articles about how minivans had actually barely gone up in price even though people were desperate for cars.

I got a 2006 awd sienna with nice newer tires, a 3500 pound towing package, roof racks, sunroof, power doors and hatch, disc brakes, an absolutely cavernous interior with removable seats that can fit a full size plywood sheet, window shades, a leather interior and the top trim level audio system with a newer android touchscreen radio unit for $6000. Yah it had 180,000 but on a sienna if it is maintained well that is nothing. I mean.. all the electrical shit still works on it somehow? Also this thing is fun to drive, it isnt a sports car by any means but steering is sensitive and accurate and the wheelbase is so long it eats bumps like a couch even though the suspension isnt floaty.

If I had bought a civic it would have had 250,000+ miles, cloth seats, shit tires, huge dents and probably a replacement panel that was a mismatched color along with innumerable random small problems.

Americans hate the idea of owning a minivan more than the idea of not owning a car and it is hilarious because minivans are what you get when you take a hard look at american life and design a large vehicle for it that ticks off every box. Unless you are towing very large things frequently ever other large vehicle is a joke compared to a minivan.

I mean.. sliding doors yo... I will never buy a large vehicle without them after owning one with them.