Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

641–650 of 727 posts

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#641

Post by jorblumesea »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #99
subroutine wrote: post #44

China would be much better off if they just gave up on the whole Taiwan charade. I understand how badly they want to put Taiwan under thumb like they did HK, but Taiwan is really the only issue I foresee with potential to derail China's progress.

It isn't that easy. It's not just China's government that believes Taiwan is part of China — China's people also believe that. There is a saying that if China is democratic, they would have invaded Taiwan yesterday. Or another saying: if the president lets go of Taiwan, the CCP would be overthrown tomorrow. Another factor that complicates things is the fact that Taiwan is a strategic location for the US's military co…

The Chinese people have been indoctrinated by the CCP for decades. So to just chalk it up to the Chinese people demanding invasion is absurd and completely contrary to the facts.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#642

Post by k_sze »

synergy20 wrote: post #320
k_sze wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stop spreading nonsense. Xi Jinping studied chemical engineering. Zhu Rongji studied electrical engineering.

Zhu took the tests and get admitted, like the rest of his peers(Jiang, Hu, Wen, Li,etc) they're all true graduates from the best universities in China then, which explains why China made leaps and bounds under their leadership. Xi is the only exception among them. Xi got in college without _any_ tests, purely because he has a powerful father then. It's said he could not understand a thing taught and there is no way h…

He was at least studying for PhD in Law, according to Xinhua News Agency. I’m not entirely sure whether he ended up getting the PhD. The wording in Chinese is a bit ambiguous.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#643

Post by eloisius »

noirchen wrote: post #630

I feel it amused that people here are discussing what and how Lithuania and the west can do to 'confront' China, but everyone in east Asia knows that before the next Taiwan election in 2024, China will do something to achieve some sort of reunification, either by forcing the Taiwanese government back to the old One-China promise (which is unlikely because the pro-China KMT lost power long ago) or by toppling the pro-…

I'm curious how you know the real sentiment in Taiwan, and also how you arrived at the conclusion that everyone in east Asia knows China will attempt unification before the next election? I live in Taiwan, and I've never met anyone that said fuck the U.S. for not offering real support. I've heard people acknowledge that the U.S. doesn't sell Taiwan the latest defense tech, but are also aware that Taiwan is a rich country and can afford to pay for its own defense. The U.S. shouldn't discourage Taiwan from developing its own capabilities.

As for invasion within the next two years, I suppose none but some inner circle in China really knows, but that it's a guaranteed fact is not a consensus belief here. If it was true, people and money would be pouring out of Taiwan. From the outside, Taiwan sounds like a besieged island expecting incoming missiles any moment, but life is typical here. People are concerned with real estate prices, getting a promotion at work, construction noise in the neighborhood, climate change, etc. You'd think a place with such grim prospects about the future wouldn't have time to worry about animal welfare or environmentalism. However, any given weekend you can find thousands of volunteers going to clean up litter on beaches, or working in animal shelters.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#644

Post by noirchen »

eloisius wrote: post #643
noirchen wrote: post #630

I feel it amused that people here are discussing what and how Lithuania and the west can do to 'confront' China, but everyone in east Asia knows that before the next Taiwan election in 2024, China will do something to achieve some sort of reunification, either by forcing the Taiwanese government back to the old One-China promise (which is unlikely because the pro-China KMT lost power long ago) or by toppling the pro-…

I'm curious how you know the real sentiment in Taiwan, and also how you arrived at the conclusion that everyone in east Asia knows China will attempt unification before the next election? I live in Taiwan, and I've never met anyone that said fuck the U.S. for not offering real support. I've heard people acknowledge that the U.S. doesn't sell Taiwan the latest defense tech, but are also aware that Taiwan is a rich cou…

Do you watch Taiwanese political talk show? Basically guests from both sides in the shows agree that the next election is going to be important. They do openly expressed their anger over the position of the Biden administration. At least for some people across the straits (maybe we can add some people in Japan and Singapore) they are expecting something big to happen between the end of the winter olympics and the 2024 election.

In Taiwan you see Taiwan is not grim, for the geopolitics people they are predicting big change, but from the outside it appears that Taiwan is doomed. This, if you think about it, is really the biggest problem for the DPP government: ordinary Taiwanese people do not really care if they are reunified, while some learned people are worried, and the US can do nothing. The day after the US fled Afghanistan, high rank government officials told the press that "we are not Afghanistan". Yes, no other countries want to occupy Kabul except for the yankees.

And why would the economics be bad if China finally annex Taiwan? Cash from China has been flowing into Taiwan for 40 years, and the rich in Taiwan knows that all too well. Internationally sanction? Do you think who in the world is in bad need of Chinese products now? Taiwanese cannot even count on their leaders. Legislators and local government leaders have always been able to send someone (or in person) to visit their family graves in China and the Chinese government permits it. In Chinese culture, that speaks more than their public speeches.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#646

Post by edwinyzh »

motiejus wrote: post #200

I am Lithuanian; Lithuania Taiwan PRC conflict is frequently a topic of discussion these days among my peers. My position, shared by a few others, is that this is the next best thing that happened in Lithuania after leaving USSR: the first being joining NATO and EU in 2004. Everyone in the world can (and almost everyone do) endorse PRC. "You won't get fired for picking IBM/Oracle/PRC". While very few countries have t…

Well, I hope the US will payback well to you guys for being in line with Washington's desire and agenda.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#647

Post by FooBarWidget »

BrazzVuvuzela wrote: post #601
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US removed troops as part of the One Child Policy. Say what? Can you give some background (and, especially, evidence or documentation) for this? Because that sounds completely insane.

He means the One China Policy. But CogitoCogito is right. China is only be "contained" by Taiwan in the hypothetical circumstance of a war; during peace time they obviously have no trouble sending ships around the world and are not contained in any sense. And the only reason they haven't been able to bring Taiwan into the fold is because they keep making psychotic violent threats. All China needs to do to completely…

Yes it was a typo. My bad :(

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#648

Post by FooBarWidget »

manuelabeledo wrote: post #259
FooBarWidget wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The context of my post is that I replied to another post that talked about the west fighting China. Hence, I did not say people believe reunification needs to be achieved by force. What I did say is that if foreign forces pressure China into letting Taiwan go, then China will fight back.

> I did not say people believe reunification needs to be achieved by force. Then this line: > if the president lets go of Taiwan, the CCP would be overthrown tomorrow. doesn't make much sense to me. Who would overthrow the CCP, if not the Chinese people? And if they would be willing to do that, why wouldn't they believe in achieving reunification by force?

Many accept the status quo in which Taiwan is de facto self ruled but at least there is an aspiration towards future reunification by peaceful means, and in which Taiwan identifies as Chinese (just disagreeing on the government). As one of my (Chinese) family members put it: we can be very flexible and patient in arrangements as long as you reconize you're Chinese; who is the government is not the most imporant.

Letting go of the reunification aspiration entirely, and letting Taiwan relinquish their identity as Chinese, is a whole different matter and would make lots of people angry. It would be seen as a sign of a weak government, one which is in collusion with foreign forces to destroy Chinese sovereignty; an extension of early 20th century efforts by the west to balkanize China. The CCP will lose legitimacy.

Once CCP is overthrown, who can say whether the new policy is peaceful? Maybe a populist will make use of the anger to incite people to call for an invasion.

The CCP are actually moderates. Be careful of what you wish for.

Re: Lithuania evacuates its embassy in China

#649

Post by Koiwai »

noirchen wrote: post #630

I feel it amused that people here are discussing what and how Lithuania and the west can do to 'confront' China, but everyone in east Asia knows that before the next Taiwan election in 2024, China will do something to achieve some sort of reunification, either by forcing the Taiwanese government back to the old One-China promise (which is unlikely because the pro-China KMT lost power long ago) or by toppling the pro-…

As a Chinese, I can't agree with you more.
Post reply on HN