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Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

theatlantic.com

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Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#641

Post by nr2x »

vharish wrote: post #102
nr2x wrote: post #20

Having spent a lot of time doing MS admissions at a top-tier CS program, I never really cared that much about specific scores unless they were absolutely terrible. Tests don’t tell you much about an applicant, essays are more helpful to know if somebody can be successful. We did away with tests and I didn’t miss them.

Can't essays be gamed? And if one is better at writing essays, it doesn't necessarily mean he is better at other stuff. MS admissions in particular have people applying from different countries, countries where English is not the primary language.

You learn to spot it pretty fast, especially b/c we did a video screen as well.

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#642

Post by nr2x »

nyc640 wrote: post #181
nr2x wrote: post #20

Having spent a lot of time doing MS admissions at a top-tier CS program, I never really cared that much about specific scores unless they were absolutely terrible. Tests don’t tell you much about an applicant, essays are more helpful to know if somebody can be successful. We did away with tests and I didn’t miss them.

I can see how essays for graduate admissions can be more useful since you have to make a personal statement about your academic/research interests, how the program would help you accomplish your goals, etc. But for undergraduate admissions, the essays are the easiest part of your application to game since they ask about very generic life experiences (e.g. tell us about a hardship you overcame) that are unverifiable.…

If you read several hundred the professional ones are easy to spot. Sometimes people use the same company to write essay and you’ll find reused materials!

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#643

Post by nr2x »

panda88888 wrote: post #309
vharish wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't essays be gamed? And if one is better at writing essays, it doesn't necessarily mean he is better at other stuff. MS admissions in particular have people applying from different countries, countries where English is not the primary language.

IMO essay is easier games than the SAT. There is no guarantee on how much essay is actually written by the student compared to SAT, where it actually checks the ID. If anything, if I have the means I would have consultants work with my kid on choosing a topic, then heavily edited for impact while retaining the student’s writing style.

To my point above, it’s easy to spot a “fake” essay. More so than fraudulent test scores actually.

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#644

Post by lordlimecat »

daddylongstroke wrote: post #631
lordlimecat wrote: post #622

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have worked at companies where their referral bonus schedule rewards white males at one-quarter the rate of female Asians. But the application of course states that race and gender are not considered....hmmm.

Haha. Yep, same here. Just saw an email from our corporate HR head saying that we're paying an extra $1500 per referral for people considered a "minority" by the federal government definitions. I work at a tech co. where white people are a minority (less than 39%), so not sure what type of gobment subsidy they're after now?

It's not generally government subsidy, its "corporate ethics" which is to say PR and investor relations. It "looks good" and attracts business, especially government.

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#645

Post by failwhaleshark »

zdragnar wrote: post #424
failwhaleshark wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. Packing unprepared students in based on non-merit items (including legacy) and disadvantaging prepared students is absolutely ridiculous. It's bad enough that the standards are low for student athletes because it's all about talent-recruitment business and NCAA $$$, where educational attainment is tertiary.

Some schools are actually quite good at ensuring student athletes need to actually be students in addition to athletes. The necessary discipline to simultaneously train in rigorous athletics and scholarship can make for a compelling case. Alas, my alma mater did not, and it was pretty obvious to everyone that they were athletes first, and kept up appearances about schooling. I am reasonably confident that several deg…

Most universities are for-profit or money-seeking pedigree- and sheepskin-mills that have long since stopped caring about academic rigor in-depth.

Picking easy majors like communications, marketing, or business.

Buying homework.

Proctorless tests.

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#646

Post by cloudfifty »

rayiner wrote: post #618
cloudfifty wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My wife and I carefully manage her younger step siblings’ course schedules to maximize GPA. We schedule meetings with professors, counselors, schedule retakes and extra credit, etc. That's like another planet for me. Should kids really need to focus on their career so early?

What else would the kids be doing? America has to compete with Asia now. The self-indulgent culture that arose from America being unchallenged on the world stage will have to come to an end. 15 years ago, I would have agreed with you because I thought the Asian system couldn’t produce innovators like the American system. China has proved that wrong.

I'm sorry, but that attitude is just pathological careerism to my ears.

Re: Why is the university of California dropping the SAT?

#647

Post by daddylongstroke »

lordlimecat wrote: post #644
daddylongstroke wrote: post #631

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha. Yep, same here. Just saw an email from our corporate HR head saying that we're paying an extra $1500 per referral for people considered a "minority" by the federal government definitions. I work at a tech co. where white people are a minority (less than 39%), so not sure what type of gobment subsidy they're after now?

It's not generally government subsidy, its "corporate ethics" which is to say PR and investor relations. It "looks good" and attracts business, especially government.

Nah, it's specifically related to government contracts according to the recruitment email footer.
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