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Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

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Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#641

Post by FpUser »

yodelshady wrote: post #617
FpUser wrote: post #594

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"Car centric infrastructure forces people to own cars." Where? I live in Toronto and I certainly do not feel that I am forced to have a car.

Toronto where the previous mayor removed bike lanes, was caught reading a book whilst driving, and called cyclists "a pain in the ass"? That Toronto? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17914504 Yeah, that sounds a welcoming place.

I do not give a shit what our previous world famous lunatic said. I just state my personal experience and I ride my bike everywhere nearly every day.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#642

Post by bluGill »

disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #627
zucker42 wrote: post #606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, I think the problem the person you replied to sees is that sentiment community board meetings are not as good at measuring what the "average citizen" wants as opinion polls. Why do CB meetings have the moral high ground?

Because they are part of a local democratic infrastructure that is actually pretty good by global standards in the US.

But we are a republic not a democracy for a reason. We don't want a minority who has time to show up to make decisions.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#643

Post by TulliusCicero »

uoaei wrote: post #490
TulliusCicero wrote: post #451

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how well will that work for 8 year olds and 80 year olds?

Cycling on roadways with motor traffic is not for everyone...

Exactly, it only works for the very few.

Accessible cycling is what we need, and that usually means physical separation from cars.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#644

Post by digital-cygnet »

noja wrote: post #571
digital-cygnet wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, most people really do not understand how fundamentally unsuited cars are to solving urban (or dense suburban) transportation problems. Without really staring at the underlying geometry, it is hard for laypeople to understand that automobile-centric development patterns are by-and-large incapable of producing the kind of human-scale, dense, walkable areas that are (1) instinctively pleasing to be in,…

Is parking possible on both sides of each apartment block (re: your blog post)?

Thanks for the comment -- yes it is, but all sides also have more apartment buildings on them so it doesnt change the analysis. I probably could have explained that better in the post

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#645

Post by digital-cygnet »

xputer wrote: post #524
digital-cygnet wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is something I've been musing over recently as well: cars really are responsible for much of what is unpleasant about city life. When people gripe about cities, their complaints are often around: * Noise. From where I sit, the only noises that filter into my apartment from the city are occasional laughs or shouted conversations from bargoers, loud trucks grinding gears on the avenues, or honking of desperate com…

Regarding crime. A huge factor in that is "eyes on the street." Car friendly streets massively reduce the eyes on the street for two reasons: 1. Cars travel fast and they obstruct the occupants' view in all kinds of directions. So the cars themselves don't really count as eyes on the street in the same way a pedestrian would. 2. Streets designed for cars are less pleasant to be in as a pedestrian or cyclist, so fewer…

Great points! I am working on a post about this and will incorporate this observation.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#646

Post by eythian »

Shivetya wrote: post #640
globular-toast wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are only comfortable in cars because they've learned to be. Before I owned a car and cycled every day I didn't once think it was uncomfortable and that I'd rather be in a car. My body was used to it.

No. Cycling is fine until its too cold, too wet, too hot, and oh I am late or I need to carry something else or .. or... or.. seriously all these articles act as if it is a viable solution day in and day out and its far from one. people like cars, buses, and other enclosed transport, all for the same reason. because it can make the weather irrelevant to the trip

Those times usually not that big of a deal anyway. Too cold you can dress up against, to warm could be a thing depending on where you are, if you're late then a bike is probably the fastest mode of transport through a busy city anyway, carrying things is definitely possible.

And these situations aren't common anyway, and I say that living somewhere where so many people bike everywhere all the time that finding parking can be an issue (though is still much easier than finding parking for a large steel box on wheels.)

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#647

Post by lm28469 »

Shivetya wrote: post #640
globular-toast wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are only comfortable in cars because they've learned to be. Before I owned a car and cycled every day I didn't once think it was uncomfortable and that I'd rather be in a car. My body was used to it.

No. Cycling is fine until its too cold, too wet, too hot, and oh I am late or I need to carry something else or .. or... or.. seriously all these articles act as if it is a viable solution day in and day out and its far from one. people like cars, buses, and other enclosed transport, all for the same reason. because it can make the weather irrelevant to the trip

> Cycling is fine until its too cold, too wet, too hot, and oh I am late or I need to carry something else or .. or... or..

Welcome to life, it's hard, and this will hardly be the worst thing you'll face. I bike year round in Berlin, all you need is a rain coat and waterproof shoes, I'm faster than cars on any trip People in the past, and a lot of people today, still live perfectly fine without cars. We fucked up by designing all of our activities around them and now we're slave to them, it doesn't have to stay like that.

Convenience will kill us all if that's all we care about and don't take into account the non monetary price of it

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#648

Post by eythian »

therealx wrote: post #466
Laarlf wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I look at European city centers where cars often times get thrown out now and: they don’t agree. Profits were way down even before COVID. Even if you offer people the option to not use their car, they will avoid it. No form of transportation will ever be as pleasant to use. Cars don’t make cities unpleasant, cities themselves are unpleasant. No matter if cars exist or not. Bikes, pedestrians and cars must be properly…

The thing that changes this is good public transport. Not buses - buses have a mindset issue. Subways, light rail, and bikes for the last mile.

Busses don't have to have a mindset issue. They don't where I live. You'll just take the bus if it's faster than the tram or goes closer to where you want to be, that's the only consideration involved.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#649

Post by globular-toast »

Shivetya wrote: post #640
globular-toast wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are only comfortable in cars because they've learned to be. Before I owned a car and cycled every day I didn't once think it was uncomfortable and that I'd rather be in a car. My body was used to it.

No. Cycling is fine until its too cold, too wet, too hot, and oh I am late or I need to carry something else or .. or... or.. seriously all these articles act as if it is a viable solution day in and day out and its far from one. people like cars, buses, and other enclosed transport, all for the same reason. because it can make the weather irrelevant to the trip

Some of my fondest memories are of when the weather was "too" something. Some of them make great stories. But I'm sure you enjoy recounting your tales about how comfortable it was in your little box. I prefer to live and experience the world.

I lived day in day out with a bicycle for years. Do you not believe me? Even now, I have a car, but I don't use it every day and I cycle if it's close enough regardless of the weather.

As for needing to carry something, you make other plans. You're on hacker news, I'm sure you're smart enough to figure it out. And being late? What? Are you advocating speeding?

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#650

Post by supert56 »

Leherenn wrote: post #623
supert56 wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cars offer a level of freedom far beyond that of public transport. That doesn’t mean they are the best vehicle to offer that freedom and electric vehicles will definitely be an improvement over ICE vehicles but in my experience as soon as you’re outside of major metropolitan cities public transport options fall apart and are often incredibly inconvenient compared to owning a car. Maybe the solution would be to build…

In my experience, currently public transport works really well for high density routes, but no one has managed to solve the low density route issue. Take a bus going towards a leaf node at 10 pm on a week day, and you're often the only one in a huge bus with the driver (that's of course if you're in a place where such a bus exists). Environmentally and economically, that's dreadful, worse than a car. I don't think pu…

Ha, I totally agree with this. I have seen so many of those big empty buses with just 1 or 2 people in them. Perhaps self-driving cars and autonomous vehicles will be the solution to this.
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