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3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

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Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#641

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

nwienert wrote: post #496
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is particularly infuriating is this specific leader made it much worse by doing things like closing the pandemic response team a couple years ago and calling it a big Democratic hoax until recently. TBH, it's very difficult to look at that 538 chart and not come to the conclusion that a large portion of Americans are idiots. And I'm not even talking about whether or not they support Trump, I'm talking about how…

Your hoax remark is purely false. From the quite-liberal Snopes: "Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax." He said Democrats were politicizing it, which is fair. It's obvious he was just playing politics as well, and also trying to keep people from panic-buying. Meanwhile, the border was already shut down with China, before February, far earlier than many ot…

OK, here is the full text of what Trump actually said:

> Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. You know that, right? Coronavirus. They’re politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs. You say, ‘How’s President Trump doing?’ They go, ‘Oh, not good, not good.’ They have no clue. They don’t have any clue. They can’t even count their votes in Iowa, they can’t even count. No they can’t. They can’t count their votes.

> One of my people came up to me and said, ‘Mr. President, they tried to beat you on Russia, Russia, Russia. That didn’t work out too well. They couldn’t do it. They tried the impeachment hoax. That was on a perfect conversation. They tried anything, they tried it over and over, they’ve been doing it since you got in. It’s all turning, they lost, it’s all turning. Think of it. Think of it. And this is their new hoax. But you know, we did something that’s been pretty amazing. We’re 15 people [cases of coronavirus infection] in this massive country. And because of the fact that we went early, we went early, we could have had a lot more than that.

So I'll just let his words stand for themselves. What is exactly is it that he is referring to as a "hoax" then? That the virus needs to be taken very seriously and is definitely not in the same vein as seasonal flu, as he's done multiple times, or directly contradicted actual experts like Dr. Fauci right on the same podium? Saying "your hoax remark is purely false" is total bullshit. Again, I'll just let Trump's words above stand for themselves.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#643

Post by treyfitty »

AtlasBarfed wrote: post #614

If the US was smart (big if...) The pandemic quarantine will accumulate pent up demand, or at least a desire to consume once it is "over". A good economic recovery would provide enough money to fund this demand and immediately reward rehiring of people to previous levels. But this will be a series of discredited supply-side measures until (perhaps) a Keynesian friendly democrat is in office.

Pent up demand for what? I’m being half facetious here, but something of this magnitude and rare will likely cause a shift in our world-views. This whole talk of “pent up demand” in Econ 101 really leads me to believe this system is guided by shibboleths and buzz phrases.

Let’s be real for a second: this pandemic will fundamentally change consumption as we recalibrate just how much we “need” that new shiny thing.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#644

Post by macintux »

llampx wrote: post #623
macintux wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Validation is the problem. If someone thinks they’ve successfully applied, rejecting them asynchronously is often worse than not letting them apply in the first place.

The government generally has no problem with rejecting filed claims after review.

I’m sure, but there’s still, I’d wager, an order of magnitude difference between the paperwork rejected now and that if users were unable to receive immediate feedback in order to correct their input.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#645

Post by nwienert »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #641
nwienert wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your hoax remark is purely false. From the quite-liberal Snopes: "Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax." He said Democrats were politicizing it, which is fair. It's obvious he was just playing politics as well, and also trying to keep people from panic-buying. Meanwhile, the border was already shut down with China, before February, far earlier than many ot…

OK, here is the full text of what Trump actually said: > Now the Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus. You know that, right? Coronavirus. They’re politicizing it. We did one of the great jobs. You say, ‘How’s President Trump doing?’ They go, ‘Oh, not good, not good.’ They have no clue. They don’t have any clue. They can’t even count their votes in Iowa, they can’t even count. No they can’t. They can’t count the…

Yea it’s pretty clear he’s saying the Democrats/media, not the virus, is the hoax, here. He already sees them propagandizing it, so he’s saying, “watch out here we go again, another thing they’ll try and twist”.

Which is funny - because you’re literally trying to twist it right here.

The “hoax” is just him saying they’re smearing him either for things he didn’t do or did wrong, even refers to it in the next sentence when he defends his early action containing the virus. He never suggests the virus itself is a hoax. That’s just plainly obvious. If you aren’t catching that, I think you’re seeing things through a very narrow liberal lense.

The border was closed to China in January. That’s a pretty early response, a lot faster than many other countries.

Sure, hes made mistakes. But your quote doesn’t make him look bad like you think it does.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#646

Post by [deleted] »

jshevek wrote: post #474
sundaeofshock wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously? There were a number of submissions yesterday to HN discussing the relative merits of sacrificing millions for the sake of the market. Perhaps you missed those?

"sacrificing millions for the sake of the market" This is an unfair way to characterize this difficult issue.

[deleted]

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#647

Post by bagacrap »

csomar wrote: post #146

> A week ago, he said he had “a good middle-class job” which paid him $35.50 an hour plus health care and retirement benefits. Now he is struggling to figure out how he’ll pay a $300 electric bill and $1,000 in rent for his townhouse. He also lost his health insurance. You make $35.5/hour in (I suppose?) a stable job but if the work stops for a week, you struggle with a $300 bill? I know some people are living payche…

yeah, not great, but the same thing has happened to many businesses. When they stop making money they can't meet their obligations (e.g. wages) and need a bailout a week later.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#648

Post by sizzle »

duxup wrote: post #17

Semi tangent, about dealing with mass unemployment. I like to think this event changes people's perspective on folks out of work in the US. There's a lot of recrimination, and even self loathing about being poor or out of work in the US. It doesn't seem based in reality and certainly isn't helpful. Perhaps it is time we realize that much like a pandemic things in this world change fast and we need to be able to help…

I can't help but draw a parallel to how machine learning and A.I. automation is supposed to disrupt a majority of blue collar jobs and if this is a taste of what is to come when we crack the code and people's skills are rendered obsolete to specialized sophisticated machinery that outperforms us in every metric and runs autonomously 24/7.

I also think about universal basic income and what life would feel like if I suddenly was left to my own devices and had the luxury to learn any subject I wanted, pursue new hobbies and crafts without dragging myself into work with stop and go traffic both ways, zapping my creative energy and making me a more jaded person day by day and the week progresses.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#649

Post by dragonwriter »

cvlasdkv wrote: post #602
dragonwriter wrote: post #508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "efficiency" and "innovation" are neoliberal buzzwords. No, efficiency and innovation are real things. Neoliberals tend to think that they are areas that neoliberal policy produces better outcomes on, and in the case of efficiency at least there is a strong theoretical case that this is true in a very narrow range of hyper-idealized conditions. People who are not neoliberals often agree that efficiency and innovati…

> People who are not neoliberals often agree that efficiency and innovation are important (though perhaps not of as paramount importance as neoliberals tend to portray them), but often disagree with neoliberals as to the optimality of neoliberal policies at producing them outside of the kind of simplified conditions that dominate the first couple weeks of undergraduate economics classes. People who are not neoliberal…

> People who are not neoliberals often agree that efficiency and innovation are important _up to the point where needs are met for all_. No leftist uses efficiency/innovation as a target (and if they do chase it for the sake of productivity they are by definition not left of capital).

Plenty of leftists, agree with neoliberals that utilitarian efficiency ought to be a key goal of an economic system. Leftists, unlike neoliberals, are unlikely to believe that the capitalist markets optimize for utilitarian efficiency, because, even aside from the general failures of the rational choice model due to imperfect information, etc. (which neoliberals often also discount), capitalist markets effectively weight individual utility differently based on the individual’s wealth.

Re: 3.28M file for U.S. jobless benefits

#650

Post by mensetmanusman »

vkou wrote: post #403
chatmasta wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure about this. China is, rightfully, being blamed for the initial outbreak of the virus and their failure to contain it. I think when the dust settles, we’re going to see a rapid decoupling from China as countries look inward to strengthen their domestic supply chains. I have a hard time seeing China emerging as a winner from this crisis.

Given how poorly the rest of the world reacted after getting two months of advance warning, I can't think of more than three countries that could have contained this outbreak. Fingerpointing at China when they reacted far more decisively then the West did seems... A tad off the mark. If this originated in Milan, Kansas, or Bangalore, we'd all be in the exact same boat today. Hell, if the outbreak started in Kansas, w…

Not sure it is fair to say that the world really had advanced warning from China. They were saying everything was okay and people-people transmission is low. All trust was lost, so time was reset when Italy was hit, that is the real time zero, because no one trusts China.
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