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Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

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641–650 of 901 posts

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Years ago, I had a class on Homelessness and Public Policy through SFSU. At the time, SF had about as many homeless as NY in a city with about one tenth the population, IIRC. I spent 6 years on the street. I blog about homelessness and have done at least a little paid writing on the subject. My blog and other online activities keep me in touch with homeless people. I have also been interviewed by reporters because of…

It’s very easy to contemplate how to solve this problem: make it easy to build extremely dense housing in SF. The problem is that the powers that be don’t want to make it easier, and they all have ultimately self serving excuses as to why. Every time a politician tells me more housing won’t make it cheaper, I posit the hypothetical “what if we built 100,000 more units? No? How about 1 million more? 5 million more?” T…

Unfortunately, it isn't actually that simple.

Since WW2, the vast majority of our financing mechanisms and housing policy has been aimed at creating family housing because that was what the parents of the Baby Boomers wanted and needed. Meanwhile, our population has diversified away from that. Plus there are myriad zoning policies, tax policies etc at all levels of government that are pieces of the puzzle for how SF has ended up this way.

There isn't anyone on the planet who actually knows exactly what needs to be dismantled to untangle this mess and trying to do so comes at high risk. It isn't at all unusual for the baby to be thrown out with the bath water when dealing with things as complicated as city planning.

I wanted to be an urban planner before life got in the way. It is why I took a class on homelessness and public policy. I have a good grasp of what is generally wrong. I can't give you a point by pint list if instructions on how to fix it for SF.

San Francisco proper is physically much smaller than New York City, 231 sq. miles vs 468. Part of it is built on infill, reclaiming land from the waters around it. Such infill has serious structural limitations. You can't build on it like it is solid ground. San Francisco also needs to be built to withstand serious earthquakes. All of these geographic factors further constrain what you can realistically build there.

I generally agree that simply building more housing would help. But when I lived in Fairfield years ago, SROs in San Francisco were $1000/mo. San Francisco is one if the few US cities that still has more than a few SROs and it still is not cheap enough. I am not convinced the problem is as easy to solve as you suggest.

Easy fixes very often come at a hidden cost. That cost can be quite high, catastrophically so.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#642
post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what gets me. In SF you have a huge liberal majority and is a wealthy city. This is in a state with a liberal majority. Yet the social problems in SF are probably some of the worst in the US. It's pretty shocking.

Your observation is consistent with the belief that progressive policies are not the answer.

If politicians only pay lip service to the ideology when their major supporters are NIMBY property owners, is it really an application of progressive policies?

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#643
post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to counter this anecdata, the startup I used to work at was founded by 4 conservatives, 2 of whom met working in the George W Bush White House. We used to discuss and debate all sorts of politic topics, and in fact I was quite often in the minority (a position that didn't bother me... it was a good way to learn different perspective on some key issues). They were then and I'm sure still now are quite openly cons…

There are different types of people that call themselves conservative. The Bush's were both pro-business conservatives, but never really expoused the type of populism that Trump does. You could admit in polite company that you supported the Bushes, or Romney. You really can't admit that you support Trump in polite company without being judged harshly.

Yes, that’s because being conservative is socially okay. Being a Trump supporter is aligning with more than conservatism - it is signaling an acceptance of several divisive and socially toxic ideas. Society should and will continue to shun this openly.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#644
post #541
post #300

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The argument here is that people like you label anything you don't agree with as "intolerant" and justify social lynching of the ideas based on your likely angry or frustrated emotional assessment. This didn't start with James, although that's one of the more popular incidents. Disagreeing with operational policies that are based on politically charged ideas that we need to correct for the inequalities in outcomes ra…

Meritocracy is incompetent. It is trust destroying because it's inherently corrupt. The privileged, the elite, control the metric by which merit is defined and judged. They create a system of self-preservation that excludes others who would dilute their control. There is no such thing as privilege, elitism, without exclusion and inferiority. Meritocracy always leads to the very thing it purports to try and avoid: inc…

> Meritocracy is incompetent.

So is so called "social justice" and diversity quotas. It leads to an environment of nepotism and corruption where people aren't getting jobs because they are competent but because they have a vagina, are brown or they have the right political stance. The irony of your statement is funny, your goal is just replacing an elite by another, not unlike what happened in Soviet Russia.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> being against racial diversity is racist That made me stop and think. I'm trying to imagine a picture of someone who is against racial diversity but isn't remotely racist and whilst I agree there's no logical contradiction inherent in that position I do struggle to think of a realistic portrait of such an individual. I might be missing something here but can you spell out this position for me in a bit more detail?…

Consider that this is the majority consensus in Japan and China. Imagine going to japan and saying "guys, this workplace is far too asian, what we really need here is some more indians, africans and arabs to get this workplace into the 21st century". I think most people here could see that not going over well. Would we then think of china and japan as mostly racist? I don't really want to get into racist/racial debat…

Everything I've experienced and read about China (I'm American and lived there for a year) leads me to believe that Han Chinese in China are extremely racist. Look at how they treat their own ethnic minorities, for example (Tibetans, Uighurs, etc.).

I know less about Japan, but everything I've read suggests that Japanese are also extremely racist.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is, if your political stance is that certain groups should be denied fundamental rights, for instance, then yes, you will feel awkward around those people, and with good reason.

And who gets to decide what is and isn't a fundamental right? Remember, the majority of Californian voters voted to ban same sex marriage in 2008. That would make us (people who think same sex marriage should be a right) the minority. If your boss declared the right to firearms a fundamental right, should it empower him or her to fire anyone who donates to politicians that support gun control (in other words, almost…

The Declaration of Independence. Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#648
post #82

I find the recent uptick in progressivism in SV refreshing, and sorely needed. Then again, I've lived my entire life in liberal enclaves and do not personally identify with conservative / "family values" viewpoints.

San Francisco’s “progressivism” is undermined by how terribly the city operates. Dirty streets, aging infrastructure, crime, homelessness, laissez faire law enforcement, conservative housing policies, and extreme wealth inequality everywhere. If the progressives can’t get their own house in order, good luck selling their vision to the rest of the country.

I just moved from SF. This is the best way to put it. Agree 100%

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#649
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political views are relative. I could say that there are no hard-right parties in Europe (with mainstream ideals - I'm ignoring the fascist parties).

Fn in France and AfD in Germany are firmly right, and it seems perverse to ignore fascist parties like Jobbik and others considering their relative electoral success, even if you believe that to be a flash in the pan. I spend a good deal of time worrying about this international drift.

Fn in France are pro universal healthcare and pro nationalization of several industries. If anything, these are not "right-wing" positions. One can be anti globalist, anti-EU, anti unchecked immigration and still believe in well-fare state. Reducing the Fn to "right-wing" is a gross simplification. If anything the EU is an anti-democratic and ultra capitalistic and globalist institution.

But it seems that being left-wing is now reduced to "how much you like refugees and immigrants" these days. You can't be truly left wing and be pro EU, a despotic institution.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#650
post #541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meritocracy is incompetent. It is trust destroying because it's inherently corrupt. The privileged, the elite, control the metric by which merit is defined and judged. They create a system of self-preservation that excludes others who would dilute their control. There is no such thing as privilege, elitism, without exclusion and inferiority. Meritocracy always leads to the very thing it purports to try and avoid: inc…

> Meritocracy is incompetent. So is so called "social justice" and diversity quotas. It leads to an environment of nepotism and corruption where people aren't getting jobs because they are competent but because they have a vagina, are brown or they have the right political stance. The irony of your statement is funny, your goal is just replacing an elite by another, not unlike what happened in Soviet Russia.

I posted my experience with this on HN before...it was very disheartening: https://news.ycombinator.com/reply?id=16396441&goto=threads%...
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