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U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

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Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#631

Post by inigyou »

xboxnolifes wrote: post #440
cdrnsf wrote: post #273

This administration is on a witch hunt for anything they can identify as "antifa" when no such central organization insists. Instead it's being used as an over broad label to attack organized opposition to it's broadly unpopular policy agenda. (If you're opposed to antifascists what does that make you?)

> (If you're opposed to antifascists what does that make you? You cant judge a group by its name. Otherwise, Make America Great Again is great, the National Socialist German Workers' party seems fine, etc.

The word is being used descriptively. Opposing the National Socialist German Worker's Party doesn't mean you oppose socialists, because those aren't socialists. You could have said that a/i isn't antifascist, but you didn't say that.

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#632

Post by inigyou »

drak0n1c wrote: post #308
henearkr wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Antifa is short for "opposed to fascism". Which, you know, is the bad thing where you hurt a lot of people just because they are different from the "group" you defined, with the aim of spoliating the outsiders to enrich the members, or make them an inferior cast, etc... Having to explain why fascism is to be fought against... Ugh, what a world. Not even science-fiction writers dared to write such a nonsensic…

Nomenclature alone is meaningless. Is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea which professes anti-fascist messaging and motives both democratic and anti-fascist? I wouldn't assume every "antifa" group is principled and accurate in its diagnosis of what fascism is and who are acceptable targets for their outgroup directed aggression.

The Democratic People's Republic of Korea isn't a democratic people's republic. I don't have to say I oppose democratic people's republics in order to oppose the DPRK, because they aren't one. If I did say that I oppose democratic people's republics, wouldn't that seem mighty suspicious to you? Maybe an indicator that I was a fascist or monarchist?

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#633

Post by inigyou »

drak0n1c wrote: post #336
henearkr wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NK is a dictatorship. I don't know where you got the misunderstanding that they would be "anti-fascist"......... Anti fascist => anti dictatorship. Anti fascist means that you don't like fascism and that you are not going to let it happen passively. (Tired of explaining the obvious. But I guess that somebody has to.) A dictatorship mechanically leads to a situation where the governing group is working for their own w…

The point is that people who proclaim themselves "antifa", be they in dictatorial power over half of Korea, or merely a band of organized activists, are not automatically due credibility and trust because of some grammatical fixation that magically guarantees alignment. Do you only become skeptical when the message is twisted after winning power? "Antifa" factions in the Spanish Civil War ultimately did not win and a…

Are we talking about antifa or are we talking about all people who proclaim to be antifa?

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#634

Post by inigyou »

breppp wrote: post #472
cdrnsf wrote: post #273

This administration is on a witch hunt for anything they can identify as "antifa" when no such central organization insists. Instead it's being used as an over broad label to attack organized opposition to it's broadly unpopular policy agenda. (If you're opposed to antifascists what does that make you?)

[flagged]

Opposing someone who happens to be anti-fascist doesn't make you anti-anti-fascist or fascist any more than opposing someone who is blue makes you anti-blue or yellow.

However if I say all blue are terrorists and it's legal to shoot blue on sight. Then I'm anti-blue. If I say all anti-blue are terrorists and it's legal to shoot anti-blue on sight, then I'm very pro-blue. It doesn't matter if there's a bunch of green over there calling itself blue. If I meant the green calling itself blue was terrorists, then I would have said that.

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#635

Post by inigyou »

2legit2quit wrote: post #545
culi wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not how US sanctions work. When the US sanctions something, nobody is allowed to donate to them. Basically any country that trades with the US (most) has to follow according to their trade deals. Any bank that wants to be in SWIFT must block any transfers

> Any bank that wants to be in SWIFT must block any transfers. Given that SWIFT is headquartered in Belgium and Italy's major bank is one of the 24 banks on the SWIFT board, how does this "blockade" in SWIFT happen? Is the inference that all of the banks bow down to the US, even though the US only represents 2 out of the 24 banks on the board?

The US can say any bank that does business with SWIFT may not do business with the Federal Reserve. We all know who will win that battle - the one where the money is, like always.

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#637

Post by OCASMv2 »

sapphicsnail wrote: post #548
OCASMv2 wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The only people who say this are people who don't actually know anyone who is antifascist. Hell, most of the people I've met who strait up identify as antifa are probably closer to democratic socialist than communist and they tend to be pretty dweeby.

[flagged]

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#638

Post by inigyou »

jayGlow wrote: post #591
inigyou wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't forcing a provider to do business with everyone who asks just as bad? You're saying noblogs should be compelled to host nazi blogs. (Actual Nazis, not a euphemism. People who want Jews to be gassed.) You're also saying wedding cake bakers should be compelled to bake cakes for gay weddings.

A service can't be refused for reasons like religion or race, a power company cannot refuse to serve a customer because they're black or Muslim. If a company is acting as a platform or provider they should serve customers regardless of their views and this should give them protection for being liable for their customers actions. Do you think providers should be allowed to refuse service because they don't like certai…

It's a good question. If someone comes on my forum and posts "I strongly believe that all Jews should be immediately gassed" am I allowed to ban him or am I obligated to provide equal service?

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#639

Post by inigyou »

aliasxneo wrote: post #586
2legit2quit wrote: post #540

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I'm not taking those definitions literally Given that fascism had quite the bloodied history in Italy (see: Mussolini), and we're talking about a group literally based in Italy, why wouldn't you? Is it because you were unaware of said history in Italy and never experienced fascism first-hand, yourself?

Why did you pick one thing on the list and ignore all of the others?

That's a standard anti-gish-gallop tactic.

Re: U.S. sanctions against the A/I Collective

#640

Post by inigyou »

BeetleB wrote: post #231
inigyou wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep I just donated $1000

Ouch. A good friend of mine was charged with providing material support to terrorists for providing similar donations. And all his donations were prior to the US designating the recipients as terrorists. The government's arguments were "Yes yes, but you knew what you were supporting even though we hadn't designated them as such..." Hope you're not in the US.

Hope I loudly go to jail so everyone can see how corrupt things are. Hope there are street riots about it.
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